WEBVTT FILE 1 00:00:02.000 --> 00:00:07.000 Downloaded from YTS.MX 2 00:00:08.000 --> 00:00:13.000 Official YIFY movies site: YTS.MX 3 00:00:09.768 --> 00:00:12.012 - My brother Harry wanted to be more 4 00:00:12.150 --> 00:00:13.599 than just a great singer song writer. 5 00:00:13.737 --> 00:00:15.946 He wanted to change the world and he did. 6 00:00:22.401 --> 00:00:24.438 - Harry Chapin was one of the greatest storytellers 7 00:00:24.576 --> 00:00:25.611 of all time. 8 00:00:34.758 --> 00:00:37.002 - Harry was that rare combination 9 00:00:37.140 --> 00:00:41.075 of somebody with a conscience and an ability 10 00:00:41.213 --> 00:00:42.697 to write a good song. 11 00:00:47.219 --> 00:00:48.289 - Not many song writers know how 12 00:00:48.427 --> 00:00:51.085 to tell a story the way he did. 13 00:00:51.223 --> 00:00:52.259 Not many singers know how 14 00:00:52.397 --> 00:00:55.124 to get a story across the way he did. 15 00:01:05.203 --> 00:01:07.515 - When that song first came out, 16 00:01:07.653 --> 00:01:11.968 a lot of people thought it was a Harry Chapin song. 17 00:01:12.106 --> 00:01:14.557 It used to bother me, but doesn't bother me anymore. 18 00:01:14.695 --> 00:01:16.628 Now I take it as a compliment. 19 00:01:16.766 --> 00:01:17.836 Because the truth is, 20 00:01:17.974 --> 00:01:21.046 Harry Chapin wrote the best story songs. 21 00:01:26.776 --> 00:01:29.468 - I do about 220 concerts a year, 22 00:01:29.606 --> 00:01:31.160 about a hundred which are benefits, 23 00:01:31.298 --> 00:01:33.541 about 60 of whom were for World Hunger Year. 24 00:01:33.679 --> 00:01:35.371 I also do a bunch for the Performing Arts Foundation. 25 00:01:35.509 --> 00:01:39.685 I also do about a half a dozen a year for Ralph Nader. 26 00:01:39.823 --> 00:01:41.273 I've done a couple so far this year 27 00:01:41.411 --> 00:01:43.172 for Citizens Action Fund. 28 00:01:43.310 --> 00:01:45.105 I also do things for multiple sclerosis, 29 00:01:45.243 --> 00:01:47.969 muscular dystrophy, cancer care, cystic fibrosis, 30 00:01:48.108 --> 00:01:49.281 and a couple of other things. 31 00:01:49.419 --> 00:01:51.180 If you get involved in things, 32 00:01:51.318 --> 00:01:53.285 you ended up by getting involved in more things. 33 00:01:53.423 --> 00:01:57.186 - Harry made it gangster to do something 34 00:01:57.324 --> 00:02:00.741 about things that need something done for it. 35 00:02:00.879 --> 00:02:03.468 - And that was Harry's spirit indomitable spirit. 36 00:02:03.606 --> 00:02:05.159 He never gave up. 37 00:02:08.714 --> 00:02:09.922 - Steve Chapin. 38 00:02:14.168 --> 00:02:18.207 - It was like he knew that there was X amount 39 00:02:18.345 --> 00:02:22.728 of time left, because he really did burn that candle, 40 00:02:22.866 --> 00:02:24.385 bright and fast. 41 00:02:26.801 --> 00:02:28.389 - What's that great line of Bob Dylan's? 42 00:02:28.527 --> 00:02:30.495 He is not busy being born, he's busy dying. 43 00:02:30.633 --> 00:02:32.117 Luckily I'm one of these people. 44 00:02:32.255 --> 00:02:35.603 My credo was when in doubt, do something. 45 00:02:36.708 --> 00:02:39.159 You're a little early, guys. 46 00:02:44.474 --> 00:02:48.133 Okay, big climax later on, here's the story. 47 00:02:54.898 --> 00:02:57.211 My mother always told me it'd be like this. 48 00:02:59.420 --> 00:03:03.044 - To regard Harry as merely a singer composer, 49 00:03:03.183 --> 00:03:04.425 which he was, 50 00:03:04.563 --> 00:03:08.567 is like considering babe Ruth a pitcher, which he was. 51 00:03:08.705 --> 00:03:10.811 Both were that, but far more than that. 52 00:03:10.949 --> 00:03:14.780 Harry quite simply was the leading citizen artist 53 00:03:14.918 --> 00:03:16.575 of his generation. 54 00:03:29.726 --> 00:03:31.797 - Harry champion is an artist who has been with us before 55 00:03:31.935 --> 00:03:33.868 with his guitar and with his voice. 56 00:03:34.006 --> 00:03:34.731 - Please do it for us, all right? 57 00:03:34.869 --> 00:03:35.629 - Love to. 58 00:03:35.767 --> 00:03:36.664 - Harry Chapin. 59 00:03:36.802 --> 00:03:37.838 - Once again, here is Harry Chapin. 60 00:03:48.262 --> 00:03:51.852 - My mom had four boys by the time she was 25 61 00:03:51.990 --> 00:03:54.475 with my dad, the jazz drummer, Jim Chapin. 62 00:03:54.613 --> 00:03:57.685 The oldest with James, Butch Chapin, and then Harry, 63 00:03:57.823 --> 00:04:00.412 and I was next, and then brother Steve. 64 00:04:00.550 --> 00:04:01.620 But my mother and dad divorced early. 65 00:04:01.758 --> 00:04:03.173 I was three, I think, when they divorced 66 00:04:03.312 --> 00:04:05.590 because dad was a jazz drummer and he was on the road 67 00:04:05.728 --> 00:04:08.731 and he loved drums and he loved women. 68 00:04:08.869 --> 00:04:10.284 It didn't work. 69 00:04:15.462 --> 00:04:17.705 We lived near here, West 11th Street, in the winters. 70 00:04:22.641 --> 00:04:23.918 - As a fly ball hit out to left field, 71 00:04:24.056 --> 00:04:26.196 Woodling getting under it. 72 00:04:26.335 --> 00:04:27.922 And the Yankees are champions! 73 00:04:28.060 --> 00:04:31.650 And look at Berra, piggyback riding Kuzava. 74 00:04:33.859 --> 00:04:36.414 And then my stepfather came in the family. 75 00:04:36.552 --> 00:04:40.176 He bought a brownstone in Brooklyn for $16,000. 76 00:04:40.314 --> 00:04:44.284 - My mother Jean Elsbeth Burke had six sons. 77 00:04:44.422 --> 00:04:46.872 Harry was number two and I was number five. 78 00:04:47.010 --> 00:04:49.565 My mother had four Chapins in two Harts. 79 00:04:49.703 --> 00:04:51.360 And she was an incredible woman 80 00:04:51.498 --> 00:04:54.224 who raised us all basically as a single mom, 81 00:04:54.363 --> 00:04:59.368 because both of her husbands were kind of not great choices. 82 00:04:59.920 --> 00:05:02.198 - We had the unfortunate, or fortunate if you want, 83 00:05:02.336 --> 00:05:05.270 of having the storybook evil stepfather. 84 00:05:05.408 --> 00:05:07.376 He was well meaning, but unfortunately he couldn't handle 85 00:05:07.514 --> 00:05:11.449 four boys growing up and it was a horror show 86 00:05:11.587 --> 00:05:13.243 of beatings and all kinds of stuff. 87 00:05:13.382 --> 00:05:15.729 It just made us really tight. 88 00:05:19.905 --> 00:05:22.805 - We grew up in the school yards and at Grace Church. 89 00:05:22.943 --> 00:05:25.497 Grace Church was crucial to us. 90 00:05:25.635 --> 00:05:28.362 It was really the foundation of getting into music, 91 00:05:28.500 --> 00:05:31.227 of Harry, Tom, and Steve getting into music. 92 00:05:31.365 --> 00:05:34.195 Big John Wallace, Bobby Lamm, who we see in Chicago, 93 00:05:34.334 --> 00:05:35.611 was in the choir. 94 00:05:35.749 --> 00:05:37.647 - You know, going back to the choir room and the piano, 95 00:05:37.785 --> 00:05:40.098 it really opened up a channel 96 00:05:41.513 --> 00:05:43.964 that I wouldn't have otherwise had. 97 00:05:44.102 --> 00:05:45.655 - We kind of grew up on our own 98 00:05:45.793 --> 00:05:48.658 out there in the world, but the church and sports 99 00:05:48.796 --> 00:05:51.247 were the foundations while my mom was trying 100 00:05:51.385 --> 00:05:54.215 to be a single mom and work and have six boys 101 00:05:54.354 --> 00:05:55.527 that were all over the place. 102 00:05:55.665 --> 00:05:57.426 - Well, once we moved to Brooklyn Heights, 103 00:05:57.564 --> 00:05:58.944 it was a school yard. 104 00:05:59.082 --> 00:06:00.843 The school and the school yard were right next door to us. 105 00:06:00.981 --> 00:06:04.225 Our days were like literally eight hours of handball, 106 00:06:04.364 --> 00:06:07.608 stickball, ring-a-levio, stoop ball 107 00:06:07.746 --> 00:06:11.336 and anything with a ball, any place, anyhow, 108 00:06:11.474 --> 00:06:14.408 it was just active, active, active. 109 00:06:21.001 --> 00:06:23.417 - There's more family history probably out here 110 00:06:23.555 --> 00:06:25.626 than anywhere else. 111 00:06:25.764 --> 00:06:28.284 - Because it's an older place, that's why. 112 00:06:28.422 --> 00:06:30.597 Well, this is every summer, you know, 113 00:06:30.735 --> 00:06:32.978 we were kids and it was like, yay, it's June. 114 00:06:33.116 --> 00:06:35.912 And we'd get here and then it's barefoot, and it was tennis, 115 00:06:36.050 --> 00:06:37.500 it was the Lake. 116 00:06:37.638 --> 00:06:39.709 So this is my whole life, every summer. 117 00:06:39.847 --> 00:06:44.265 - Andover was a kind of ever-shifting feast of people. 118 00:06:44.404 --> 00:06:45.474 First of all, there was KB 119 00:06:45.612 --> 00:06:47.786 who was the presiding patriarchal genius 120 00:06:47.924 --> 00:06:51.618 who appeared to me the most brilliant man in America. 121 00:06:51.756 --> 00:06:54.517 - Harry never thought about money growing up. 122 00:06:54.655 --> 00:06:55.622 He didn't have to. 123 00:06:55.760 --> 00:06:57.865 His family, while not monetarily rich, 124 00:06:58.003 --> 00:07:01.869 they were rich in being part of the intellectual 125 00:07:02.007 --> 00:07:04.631 give and take in the country of being part 126 00:07:04.769 --> 00:07:06.529 of the American art history. 127 00:07:06.667 --> 00:07:10.878 And so Harry really never had to think about money. 128 00:07:21.958 --> 00:07:23.512 - I was a rich little poor boy. 129 00:07:23.650 --> 00:07:24.720 You've heard of the poor little rich boys. 130 00:07:24.858 --> 00:07:25.893 People with a lot of money 131 00:07:26.031 --> 00:07:27.412 and very little inspiration, very little. 132 00:07:27.550 --> 00:07:29.690 I came up with an incredible family. 133 00:07:29.828 --> 00:07:30.933 No money, but I never went hungry. 134 00:07:31.071 --> 00:07:32.866 But people who asked the right questions, 135 00:07:33.004 --> 00:07:34.005 pushed and prodded you. 136 00:07:34.143 --> 00:07:36.007 - You had a mixture of filmmakers. 137 00:07:36.145 --> 00:07:37.802 You have little Ricky, who was making films. 138 00:07:37.940 --> 00:07:40.390 You have, Jim was bringing out half of, you know, 139 00:07:40.529 --> 00:07:42.013 the Harlem left is coming out. 140 00:07:42.151 --> 00:07:44.498 It's just this constant swirl of different kinds 141 00:07:44.636 --> 00:07:46.362 of people and experiences. 142 00:07:46.500 --> 00:07:48.916 All of them creative, most of them on the left, 143 00:07:49.054 --> 00:07:50.470 one kind to another. 144 00:07:50.608 --> 00:07:52.644 - Hey, if I were Jewish then call it a mitzvah. 145 00:07:52.782 --> 00:07:56.924 For him to use his God given gifts to do good. 146 00:07:57.062 --> 00:08:00.825 - The thrust for us was to find something in the arts 147 00:08:00.963 --> 00:08:03.897 that you spent your life doing. 148 00:08:04.035 --> 00:08:05.864 It wasn't about making a living. 149 00:08:06.002 --> 00:08:07.763 It wasn't about making a lot of money. 150 00:08:07.901 --> 00:08:10.628 Wasn't even about fame that so much, 151 00:08:10.766 --> 00:08:12.906 but it's something that you've put into the world 152 00:08:13.044 --> 00:08:15.736 and put your life toward. 153 00:08:15.874 --> 00:08:17.980 - There's a kid out on my corner, 154 00:08:18.118 --> 00:08:19.533 hear him strumming like a fool. 155 00:08:19.671 --> 00:08:22.743 Shivering in his dungarees, but still he's going to school. 156 00:08:31.752 --> 00:08:33.823 - Harry was the can do. 157 00:08:33.961 --> 00:08:36.412 The family joke, which I coined at one time 158 00:08:36.550 --> 00:08:38.932 and everybody loved, was two's company, 159 00:08:39.070 --> 00:08:42.694 Harry's a crowd. 160 00:08:56.777 --> 00:08:58.952 - My mother's sister had the only Hi-Fi in the valley. 161 00:08:59.090 --> 00:09:00.298 Remember Hi-Fis? 162 00:09:00.436 --> 00:09:02.749 And she brought a recording called The Weavers 163 00:09:02.887 --> 00:09:06.028 at Carnegie Hall and played it for us. 164 00:09:07.063 --> 00:09:12.068 And that changed our world as it did the world of this place 165 00:09:12.828 --> 00:09:13.967 and The Village, 166 00:09:14.105 --> 00:09:17.971 because they were the inspiration for 167 00:09:18.109 --> 00:09:20.525 for the Kingston Trio, for the Limeliters, 168 00:09:20.663 --> 00:09:23.424 the Tom Paxton on down the line and, 169 00:09:23.563 --> 00:09:25.150 and the Chapin Brothers as well. 170 00:09:25.288 --> 00:09:27.636 We listen to that recording all summer long. 171 00:09:34.194 --> 00:09:35.575 If you invited one Chapin brother, 172 00:09:35.713 --> 00:09:37.128 the three of us would come with instruments. 173 00:09:37.266 --> 00:09:39.199 Steve first played a 10-string ukulele 174 00:09:39.337 --> 00:09:40.925 and then moved on to the bass. 175 00:09:41.063 --> 00:09:43.237 And we became the Chapin Brothers. 176 00:09:45.239 --> 00:09:47.034 - Tonight, let's sing out 177 00:09:47.172 --> 00:09:51.591 with the students of the University of 178 00:09:51.729 --> 00:09:53.834 Featuring Joanie Anderson. 179 00:09:57.079 --> 00:09:58.080 The Chapins. 180 00:09:59.081 --> 00:10:00.910 And now, Oscar Brown. 181 00:10:02.325 --> 00:10:04.707 That loud blast of assembles and the bass you heard 182 00:10:04.845 --> 00:10:07.261 came from a drum, which is new to our program. 183 00:10:07.399 --> 00:10:11.507 But is being handled by the capable Mr. Chapin. 184 00:10:11.645 --> 00:10:12.646 Mr. Steve Chapin. 185 00:10:12.784 --> 00:10:13.751 - Jim Chapin. - Jim Chapin? 186 00:10:13.889 --> 00:10:14.855 - I'm Steve. 187 00:10:14.993 --> 00:10:15.822 - You're Steve. Well, who are you? 188 00:10:15.960 --> 00:10:17.099 - Tom. - That's Tom. 189 00:10:17.237 --> 00:10:17.996 Over there? 190 00:10:18.134 --> 00:10:19.239 - Harry! - Harry. 191 00:10:19.377 --> 00:10:21.172 And all together they're the Chapin Family. 192 00:10:21.310 --> 00:10:23.553 - Their father is considered one of the great drummers 193 00:10:23.692 --> 00:10:26.695 in America, and we're proud to produce the whole family. 194 00:10:26.833 --> 00:10:28.835 So here are the Chapins. 195 00:10:39.328 --> 00:10:41.157 - Harry was the least proficient musically, 196 00:10:41.295 --> 00:10:43.573 so it was kind of like everybody 197 00:10:43.712 --> 00:10:46.128 had their power in different ways. 198 00:10:51.927 --> 00:10:53.791 - Tom had a really high voice 199 00:10:53.929 --> 00:10:56.103 and could hit notes that were unattainable 200 00:10:56.241 --> 00:10:58.209 and is an excellent guitar player. 201 00:10:58.347 --> 00:11:00.176 Both of us, Tom and I, could both 202 00:11:00.314 --> 00:11:04.318 really well sing in tune and blend really well. 203 00:11:11.360 --> 00:11:13.293 - Love the idea of making music 204 00:11:13.431 --> 00:11:16.710 and and Harry started writing for us as well. 205 00:11:16.848 --> 00:11:18.954 That's really sort of the genesis of the Chapin Brothers 206 00:11:19.092 --> 00:11:21.991 and the connection with folk music. 207 00:11:23.061 --> 00:11:24.338 - Harry was kind of like in charge 208 00:11:24.476 --> 00:11:26.962 and actually a lot of times they would, they would, 209 00:11:27.100 --> 00:11:28.308 you know, other people behind 210 00:11:28.446 --> 00:11:29.861 would say you guys got to do more. 211 00:11:29.999 --> 00:11:32.070 Three of us were playing with our dad in the Village Gate. 212 00:11:32.208 --> 00:11:34.314 After the first set, dad comes back to his boys and says, 213 00:11:34.452 --> 00:11:36.799 it's a little slow out there tonight. 214 00:11:36.937 --> 00:11:39.250 Steve and Tom, I want you guys to cheer up. 215 00:11:39.388 --> 00:11:41.010 Harry, cheer down. 216 00:11:55.887 --> 00:11:56.992 - We were living in Brooklyn Heights, 217 00:11:57.130 --> 00:11:59.684 not exactly the center of the folk music universe. 218 00:11:59.822 --> 00:12:03.653 But was 15 minutes by the A train to here. 219 00:12:03.792 --> 00:12:06.691 Tuesday night was hootenanny night here at the Bitter End. 220 00:12:06.829 --> 00:12:08.935 And if you came in the afternoon and you tried out for it, 221 00:12:09.073 --> 00:12:10.591 you might be able to play that night. 222 00:12:10.730 --> 00:12:12.110 And we started doing that. 223 00:12:12.248 --> 00:12:14.803 - Harry got this film offer to go to Ethiopia, 224 00:12:14.941 --> 00:12:18.254 to do a documentary about hunger in Ethiopia. 225 00:12:18.392 --> 00:12:20.084 And Harry was a grownup, you know, 226 00:12:20.222 --> 00:12:21.913 he'd been working in the documentary film world. 227 00:12:22.051 --> 00:12:23.673 In fact, one of his documentary films 228 00:12:23.812 --> 00:12:26.400 was nominated for Academy Award, "The Legendary Champions." 229 00:12:30.232 --> 00:12:31.923 - Tiny Tommy Burns is soon getting home 230 00:12:32.061 --> 00:12:35.168 with his equalizer, his booming right hand. 231 00:12:35.306 --> 00:12:36.825 Spires goes down. 232 00:12:38.136 --> 00:12:39.655 - Harry came back six months later, 233 00:12:39.793 --> 00:12:41.899 and the boys who needed the money to go to college 234 00:12:42.037 --> 00:12:43.417 had put together a new band. 235 00:12:43.555 --> 00:12:44.833 - Steve says, well, you better tell him. 236 00:12:44.971 --> 00:12:47.421 So I sat there and said, Harry, 237 00:12:48.422 --> 00:12:49.976 we're kicking you out of the band. 238 00:12:50.114 --> 00:12:51.218 What? 239 00:12:51.356 --> 00:12:51.978 - There was no way he could walk back in. 240 00:12:52.116 --> 00:12:53.220 He wasn't a singer. 241 00:12:53.358 --> 00:12:55.291 We already had two guitarists in the band. 242 00:12:55.429 --> 00:12:56.672 You know what I mean? 243 00:12:56.810 --> 00:12:58.156 At this time he didn't bring anything to the table. 244 00:12:58.294 --> 00:13:00.400 - The Chapins had a really cool rock and roll band. 245 00:13:00.538 --> 00:13:03.196 And when Harry came back, he was no longer part of it. 246 00:13:03.334 --> 00:13:04.887 I understood that. 247 00:13:05.025 --> 00:13:08.166 Cause it was, in terms of like musical judgment and judging, 248 00:13:08.304 --> 00:13:09.719 it was the right decision. 249 00:13:09.858 --> 00:13:11.583 - I mean, I come from a family 250 00:13:11.721 --> 00:13:13.344 of absolutely brilliant people. 251 00:13:13.482 --> 00:13:14.828 I've got some brothers, as you know, 252 00:13:14.966 --> 00:13:18.314 I think are more naturally talented than I am at music. 253 00:13:18.452 --> 00:13:20.730 But the only thing different between them and I 254 00:13:20.869 --> 00:13:22.698 is I'm a little bit more bullheaded and go out 255 00:13:22.836 --> 00:13:25.390 and bang my head against the the castles. 256 00:13:25.528 --> 00:13:28.117 And they they've taken a little bit more cooled out route. 257 00:13:28.255 --> 00:13:30.740 - We rented the Village Gate for $400 a week. 258 00:13:30.879 --> 00:13:34.779 And our opening act was, the first week was Harry, 259 00:13:34.917 --> 00:13:36.367 by himself. 260 00:13:36.505 --> 00:13:39.439 And he's singing these long story songs. 261 00:13:39.577 --> 00:13:43.857 It was raining hard in Frisco, and it was dead. 262 00:13:43.995 --> 00:13:45.721 He didn't know how to perform yet. 263 00:13:45.859 --> 00:13:48.275 And the songs just lay there. 264 00:13:48.413 --> 00:13:50.415 And he did four nights, four very hard nights 265 00:13:50.553 --> 00:13:52.728 opening for us, and we were pretty good band. 266 00:13:52.866 --> 00:13:55.248 So instead of being crushed by this, he says, 267 00:13:55.386 --> 00:13:56.974 hmm, I need a band. 268 00:13:57.112 --> 00:14:00.736 He calls up John Wallace, who'd been a choir boy with us, 269 00:14:00.874 --> 00:14:04.119 to play bass, found a guitar player, Ron Palmer, 270 00:14:04.257 --> 00:14:06.017 wonderful finger style guitar player. 271 00:14:06.155 --> 00:14:08.986 Put an ad in the Village Voice for a cello player, 272 00:14:09.124 --> 00:14:10.504 and got Tim Scott. 273 00:14:11.540 --> 00:14:13.853 And they started rehearsing and inventing these songs. 274 00:14:13.991 --> 00:14:17.270 - He said, listen, I don't have any money. 275 00:14:18.512 --> 00:14:23.103 He said that the most important thing to me is loyalty. 276 00:14:23.241 --> 00:14:26.969 He said if stay with me, we're all going to be partners. 277 00:14:27.107 --> 00:14:29.282 It was a handshake deal. 278 00:14:29.420 --> 00:14:34.321 And it was kept not only by Harry, but by the family. 279 00:14:34.459 --> 00:14:36.392 He knew what he wanted. 280 00:14:40.431 --> 00:14:41.328 - It would be nice, the ninth. 281 00:14:41.466 --> 00:14:44.090 There's ninth and the major seven. 282 00:14:51.373 --> 00:14:53.237 I wonder if you should hit the 4th up there. 283 00:14:56.481 --> 00:15:00.451 - Harry's songs started getting a little more adventuresome 284 00:15:00.589 --> 00:15:03.074 and a little more story-oriented, 285 00:15:03.212 --> 00:15:04.834 a little more personally oriented. 286 00:15:04.973 --> 00:15:06.491 - He was ambitious. 287 00:15:07.561 --> 00:15:09.460 He really wanted to matter. 288 00:15:09.598 --> 00:15:12.014 - What I saw was not what I expected. 289 00:15:12.152 --> 00:15:13.878 I lost it in the first number. 290 00:15:14.016 --> 00:15:16.260 I mean, I could tell what was going on. 291 00:15:16.398 --> 00:15:18.952 This was a very well integrated band, vocally. 292 00:15:19.090 --> 00:15:21.299 The instruments were wonderful, 293 00:15:21.437 --> 00:15:25.579 but I thought featuring the sincerity of the cello was magic 294 00:15:25.717 --> 00:15:27.547 because I had tried to talk artists to doing that 295 00:15:27.685 --> 00:15:31.344 in the past myself and had not succeeded. 296 00:15:31.482 --> 00:15:34.278 They were comfortable with the instruments they had. 297 00:15:34.416 --> 00:15:36.866 And I was looking for something that would give 298 00:15:37.005 --> 00:15:40.077 even folk music an underpinning. 299 00:15:40.215 --> 00:15:41.837 - There's something about a cello anyway, 300 00:15:41.975 --> 00:15:43.390 that plays in minor keys. 301 00:15:43.528 --> 00:15:46.359 And it was magical with his music 302 00:15:46.497 --> 00:15:48.361 because it was so appropriate, 303 00:15:48.499 --> 00:15:52.296 because so much was visually dramatic and emotional and sad. 304 00:15:52.434 --> 00:15:54.401 You know, so there's nothing sadder 305 00:15:54.539 --> 00:15:56.610 than somebody sitting next to you playing 306 00:15:56.748 --> 00:16:00.200 just beautiful string lines on the cello. 307 00:16:04.308 --> 00:16:05.999 - There was a couple of quirky things that Harry did 308 00:16:06.137 --> 00:16:08.174 that made him stand apart from other people. 309 00:16:08.312 --> 00:16:11.867 Also the guy who was singing falsetto. 310 00:16:12.005 --> 00:16:13.903 The guy's in the back row with a real high voice. 311 00:16:14.042 --> 00:16:15.905 Like an opera singer, almost. 312 00:16:16.044 --> 00:16:18.080 That was different too. 313 00:16:21.118 --> 00:16:23.499 - I was really kind of shocked to see John Wallace 314 00:16:23.637 --> 00:16:26.054 be part of the whole thing. 315 00:16:26.192 --> 00:16:29.540 John always had a great voice, great falsetto, 316 00:16:29.678 --> 00:16:33.544 and he always fooled around with his range, 317 00:16:33.682 --> 00:16:36.996 singing low notes, singing high notes. 318 00:16:41.655 --> 00:16:44.555 - And then Harry was, you know, telling his story. 319 00:16:44.693 --> 00:16:46.212 It made him stand out. 320 00:16:46.350 --> 00:16:49.560 - Listen to the story about Mr. Tanner. 321 00:16:59.294 --> 00:17:03.298 - I always thought of him as a troubadour. 322 00:17:12.583 --> 00:17:16.690 This is a person who, you know, I don't know, 323 00:17:16.828 --> 00:17:21.833 I mean, listen, he sang great, it was a charm that he had, 324 00:17:22.317 --> 00:17:25.596 but I think his real gift was the storytelling. 325 00:17:35.330 --> 00:17:37.297 - And so that, right in front of him, 326 00:17:37.435 --> 00:17:39.403 was this possibility of being a singer song writer. 327 00:17:39.541 --> 00:17:44.304 And two weeks later, he comes back and it's a revelation. 328 00:17:46.513 --> 00:17:51.000 - He wrapped his songs around the people who listened. 329 00:17:58.249 --> 00:17:59.285 - It was pretty thrilling. 330 00:17:59.423 --> 00:18:02.115 He's right in the middle of that triangle 331 00:18:02.253 --> 00:18:04.566 and hearing this stuff, you know. 332 00:18:04.704 --> 00:18:06.326 You knew there was something to it. 333 00:18:06.464 --> 00:18:07.224 - Sort of part and parcel of watching him do this 334 00:18:07.362 --> 00:18:10.399 and helping as much as we can. 335 00:18:10.537 --> 00:18:15.301 And being a little bit astonished, but not shocked. 336 00:18:18.338 --> 00:18:22.239 By the end of the summer, they got a great review 337 00:18:22.377 --> 00:18:24.448 in the New York times. 338 00:18:24.586 --> 00:18:26.450 And people were coming to see Harry 339 00:18:26.588 --> 00:18:27.796 at the end of the summer. 340 00:18:27.934 --> 00:18:32.076 - When he was first acknowledged at The Village Gate 341 00:18:32.214 --> 00:18:35.183 and the record company people started coming down 342 00:18:35.321 --> 00:18:37.012 and he'd called the different companies 343 00:18:37.150 --> 00:18:38.600 and talked to one of the secretaries 344 00:18:38.738 --> 00:18:40.326 and say he was somebody else 345 00:18:40.464 --> 00:18:44.019 and then do a pitch for Harry Chapin. 346 00:18:44.157 --> 00:18:46.746 Always out in front, you know, always moving forward. 347 00:18:46.884 --> 00:18:49.266 Yeah, his motto was onwards and upwards. 348 00:18:49.404 --> 00:18:52.338 - And that was the fall that Clive Davis and Jac Holzman 349 00:18:52.476 --> 00:18:54.512 at Elektra Records and Clive Davis at Columbia 350 00:18:54.650 --> 00:18:57.136 had a bidding war to get Harry. 351 00:18:57.274 --> 00:18:59.103 - The bidding war thing started, which I mean, 352 00:18:59.241 --> 00:19:02.141 it's not a time I would like to relive, 353 00:19:02.279 --> 00:19:03.728 but it made us a lot of money. 354 00:19:03.866 --> 00:19:07.215 - Clive and I had gone toe to toe on other artists. 355 00:19:07.353 --> 00:19:10.632 Delaney and Bonnie, he had tried to take Judy Collins away. 356 00:19:10.770 --> 00:19:13.531 We were used to scrapping with each other. 357 00:19:13.669 --> 00:19:15.602 - As his brother, it was really exciting to watch 358 00:19:15.740 --> 00:19:17.225 this whole thing happen. 359 00:19:17.363 --> 00:19:18.536 - That's when the trigger went off, 360 00:19:18.674 --> 00:19:20.262 this is the band I can work with. 361 00:19:27.304 --> 00:19:28.650 We made an offer. 362 00:19:29.685 --> 00:19:31.342 Atlantic made an offer. 363 00:19:31.480 --> 00:19:33.102 Clive made an offer. 364 00:19:33.241 --> 00:19:35.726 The numbers were going back and forth. 365 00:19:50.568 --> 00:19:53.226 The band had come to my house up in the country 366 00:19:53.364 --> 00:19:55.608 because I liked to prerecord my records. 367 00:19:55.746 --> 00:19:57.541 I couldn't find Harry. 368 00:19:57.679 --> 00:19:59.128 Nobody could get ahold of them. 369 00:19:59.267 --> 00:20:01.372 Finally, I got a call back from Harry. 370 00:20:01.510 --> 00:20:03.443 I said, well, I'm on my way to California, 371 00:20:03.581 --> 00:20:06.135 then I said, we'll meet you at the airport. 372 00:20:06.274 --> 00:20:10.381 So he met us and he said, we're gonna go with Columbia. 373 00:20:10.519 --> 00:20:14.213 I was pissed off because I thought we 374 00:20:14.351 --> 00:20:16.663 had shaken hands on the deal. 375 00:20:16.801 --> 00:20:18.320 Stayed the week in California, 376 00:20:18.458 --> 00:20:21.289 I found out that the Colombia numbers were, 377 00:20:21.427 --> 00:20:23.152 shall we say, less than accurate, 378 00:20:23.291 --> 00:20:26.190 because I got the real numbers. 379 00:20:26.328 --> 00:20:28.019 But I never used them. 380 00:20:29.780 --> 00:20:31.678 Banged on the door at six o'clock in the morning, 381 00:20:31.816 --> 00:20:36.787 they knew I was coming and said, I'm not leaving here. 382 00:20:36.925 --> 00:20:38.513 Get a couch or something, 383 00:20:38.651 --> 00:20:42.241 I'm not leaving here until we have a deal. 384 00:20:51.664 --> 00:20:54.183 - Harry had his, sort of had the act together 385 00:20:54.322 --> 00:20:55.426 in its own way. 386 00:20:55.564 --> 00:20:57.497 They had this, it started off with this trick 387 00:20:57.635 --> 00:21:01.674 with the lights and Taxi was more than just a song. 388 00:21:01.812 --> 00:21:04.815 - In 72 I remember hearing the taxi on the radio 389 00:21:04.953 --> 00:21:07.542 and then thinking, this is something different. 390 00:21:07.680 --> 00:21:09.337 This is a folk song. 391 00:21:09.475 --> 00:21:10.579 Who is this guy? 392 00:21:10.717 --> 00:21:13.375 - Taxi's about 60% true. 393 00:21:13.513 --> 00:21:17.483 And so I use realities I know about to set me going. 394 00:21:17.621 --> 00:21:21.590 And then I try to make the song true to itself. 395 00:21:35.535 --> 00:21:36.709 The songs have to mean something to somebody 396 00:21:36.847 --> 00:21:40.195 if they're going to buy them or keep playing. 397 00:21:40.333 --> 00:21:41.300 - And Yours do. 398 00:21:41.438 --> 00:21:42.956 See, I think that that can be the trap 399 00:21:43.094 --> 00:21:45.890 that years mean an awful lot to a lot of people. 400 00:21:46.028 --> 00:21:50.343 - The writing there was so smart and simple at the same time 401 00:21:50.481 --> 00:21:51.931 that I thought this was special. 402 00:21:56.729 --> 00:21:58.213 - Great song. 403 00:21:58.351 --> 00:22:01.216 She said, let's get together, 404 00:22:01.354 --> 00:22:03.391 but I knew it'd never be arranged, 405 00:22:03.529 --> 00:22:06.911 And she handed me twenty dollars for a two fifty fare, 406 00:22:07.049 --> 00:22:09.500 she said Harry, keep the change. 407 00:22:09.638 --> 00:22:12.261 And that's such a cool line 408 00:22:12.400 --> 00:22:15.299 that the hair stands up on my arm. 409 00:22:15.437 --> 00:22:17.301 Well, another man might've been angry, 410 00:22:17.439 --> 00:22:18.682 another man might have been hurt, 411 00:22:18.820 --> 00:22:20.718 but another man would never would have let her go, 412 00:22:20.856 --> 00:22:23.238 I stuffed the bill on my shirt. 413 00:22:23.376 --> 00:22:25.965 I mean, that's, you know, real life. 414 00:22:26.103 --> 00:22:27.725 That's really what happened. 415 00:22:27.863 --> 00:22:30.590 Whether it did or not, in my mind, that happened. 416 00:22:30.728 --> 00:22:32.351 I could picture the whole thing. 417 00:22:32.489 --> 00:22:33.938 And the guy at the end getting stoned, 418 00:22:34.076 --> 00:22:36.458 and I fly so high when I'm stoned. 419 00:22:36.596 --> 00:22:38.909 You didn't hear that on the radio, that was pretty risque. 420 00:22:39.047 --> 00:22:41.498 - We didn't start on AM radio. 421 00:22:41.636 --> 00:22:43.776 We started on FM radio, which I knew was going 422 00:22:43.914 --> 00:22:45.364 to be more friendly to him. 423 00:22:45.502 --> 00:22:47.504 And Harry went to all the key stations 424 00:22:47.642 --> 00:22:49.747 and he told wonderful stories. 425 00:22:49.885 --> 00:22:54.269 And his personality, even if you weren't seeing him live, 426 00:22:54.407 --> 00:22:56.996 you could hear it through the interview. 427 00:22:57.134 --> 00:22:59.930 He was always there, no matter what he did, 428 00:23:00.068 --> 00:23:01.725 whether he was doing it for a charity 429 00:23:01.863 --> 00:23:06.868 or in the studio for himself, he was 100% all the time. 430 00:23:07.006 --> 00:23:09.767 - We were playing in the Kiel Opera House 431 00:23:09.905 --> 00:23:10.906 in St. Louis. 432 00:23:11.976 --> 00:23:15.394 And I was opening up for Harry Chapin. 433 00:23:22.055 --> 00:23:23.436 We got a great reception from his audience. 434 00:23:23.574 --> 00:23:26.370 I didn't know how we're gonna go over with his crowd. 435 00:23:26.508 --> 00:23:29.856 But they were very receptive, very warm audience. 436 00:23:29.994 --> 00:23:32.790 And he even talked about me to the audience 437 00:23:32.928 --> 00:23:34.205 in his own show. 438 00:23:35.206 --> 00:23:37.381 He was the headliner, but he said something, 439 00:23:37.519 --> 00:23:38.934 how about that, Billy Joel? 440 00:23:39.072 --> 00:23:40.349 And I thought that was really nice. 441 00:23:40.488 --> 00:23:41.523 He didn't have to do that. 442 00:23:41.661 --> 00:23:45.009 But he plugged me to his own audience. 443 00:23:45.147 --> 00:23:46.942 And I never forgot that. 444 00:23:47.080 --> 00:23:50.359 I thought that was a very gentlemanly thing to do. 445 00:23:50.498 --> 00:23:53.466 Especially in the music business where it's all dog-eat-dog 446 00:23:53.604 --> 00:23:56.849 and claws are out in the music business. 447 00:24:11.035 --> 00:24:13.693 - I went out to Long Island to play a club, 448 00:24:13.831 --> 00:24:16.316 just not even a club, like a pub, it was like bar 449 00:24:16.455 --> 00:24:18.940 and Harry was in the bar. 450 00:24:19.078 --> 00:24:21.390 He wasn't drinking, he was drinking a club soda. 451 00:24:21.529 --> 00:24:24.463 My favorite recollection of him, this stays with me always, 452 00:24:24.601 --> 00:24:26.706 that he looked like he just literally rolled out of bed. 453 00:24:26.844 --> 00:24:28.536 His hair was all over the place. 454 00:24:28.674 --> 00:24:30.089 He had like some wrinkled t-shirts and jeans 455 00:24:30.227 --> 00:24:32.678 that were hanging so loose. 456 00:24:32.816 --> 00:24:34.818 And he was just sitting there, talking to a guy. 457 00:24:34.956 --> 00:24:37.855 And when I started this, when I was singing, 458 00:24:37.993 --> 00:24:40.927 he came over and he said, "Hey," he goes like, 459 00:24:41.065 --> 00:24:42.032 "What's your name, and what are you doing?" 460 00:24:42.170 --> 00:24:43.412 And all this stuff. 461 00:24:43.551 --> 00:24:47.037 And I told him, and that's when he told me, he goes, 462 00:24:47.175 --> 00:24:49.695 "Well, you know, I'm doing this thing down the street." 463 00:24:49.833 --> 00:24:52.801 He goes, "You should come and audition for this 464 00:24:52.939 --> 00:24:55.494 "because I think that you would be great for this. 465 00:24:55.632 --> 00:24:56.736 "It'd be fun for you." 466 00:24:56.874 --> 00:24:59.946 And, I was, "Okay." 467 00:25:00.084 --> 00:25:01.361 You know what I mean? 468 00:25:01.500 --> 00:25:03.743 Like, this is Harry Chapin, no problem, I'm coming. 469 00:25:08.955 --> 00:25:10.681 He was very selfless. 470 00:25:10.819 --> 00:25:13.753 You know, this was genuine, this was authentic. 471 00:25:13.891 --> 00:25:15.962 And so everything that anybody ever reads about him 472 00:25:16.100 --> 00:25:18.793 or hears about him, the stories are true. 473 00:25:18.931 --> 00:25:19.897 It's true. 474 00:25:20.035 --> 00:25:21.692 You know, he was just, he was a dude. 475 00:25:21.830 --> 00:25:23.832 I mean, the best part, the rest of that story 476 00:25:23.970 --> 00:25:25.938 is that he didn't have any money. 477 00:25:26.076 --> 00:25:27.456 He was going in every pocket. 478 00:25:27.595 --> 00:25:29.562 I was like, watching him do this. 479 00:25:29.700 --> 00:25:33.083 And I said to him, do you need money? 480 00:25:33.221 --> 00:25:35.430 Which was just like absolutely ridiculous. 481 00:25:35.568 --> 00:25:36.673 You know what I mean? 482 00:25:36.811 --> 00:25:37.846 I said, "Do you need any money?" 483 00:25:37.984 --> 00:25:39.227 And he goes, "I don't have any money." 484 00:25:39.365 --> 00:25:43.093 So I gave him $5 to pay for the, whatever, club soda, 485 00:25:43.231 --> 00:25:45.578 water, I don't know what he's drinking, 486 00:25:45.716 --> 00:25:46.993 it was clear and it wasn't alcohol, I know that. 487 00:25:47.131 --> 00:25:48.581 But whether it was a 7Up, whatever, you know, 488 00:25:48.719 --> 00:25:49.720 but I gave him five bucks. 489 00:25:49.858 --> 00:25:51.170 He had no money on him. 490 00:25:51.308 --> 00:25:55.070 And he was just, you know, kinda like Colombo. 491 00:25:55.208 --> 00:25:58.557 Kind of like the musical version of Colombo. 492 00:25:58.695 --> 00:26:00.800 - First album, we were at Fillmore East 493 00:26:00.938 --> 00:26:04.597 and Harry showed up in the wings and he was very sweet. 494 00:26:04.735 --> 00:26:06.703 You know, it was great surprise to see him. 495 00:26:06.841 --> 00:26:08.877 He was very enthusiastic. 496 00:26:10.085 --> 00:26:11.846 The thing about Harry was 497 00:26:11.984 --> 00:26:16.989 that he's probably the most charming kid you'd ever know. 498 00:26:17.127 --> 00:26:18.784 - I was just like little, you know, 499 00:26:18.922 --> 00:26:20.199 a girl just singing in a bar. 500 00:26:20.337 --> 00:26:23.098 But he treated me with such respect and dignity. 501 00:26:23.236 --> 00:26:26.067 And I didn't forget that ever. 502 00:26:26.205 --> 00:26:29.933 - With '70s rock radio, especially the storytellers, 503 00:26:30.071 --> 00:26:32.867 Jim Croce, Bob Dylan, Joni Mitchell. 504 00:26:33.005 --> 00:26:37.975 But it was this one song called "Cat's in the Cradle," 505 00:26:38.113 --> 00:26:40.909 that I don't relate to, 'cause I'm a kid. 506 00:26:41.047 --> 00:26:43.256 So it was a nursery rhyme, 507 00:26:43.394 --> 00:26:45.880 but it was just the sound of the record. 508 00:26:46.018 --> 00:26:47.191 You know what I'm saying? 509 00:26:47.329 --> 00:26:49.193 That was so captivating. 510 00:26:49.331 --> 00:26:51.057 - The most original and talented young songwriter 511 00:26:51.195 --> 00:26:53.819 and performer, was nominated for a Grammy Award 512 00:26:53.957 --> 00:26:56.131 as the Best New Artist of 1972. 513 00:26:56.269 --> 00:26:58.927 Would you please welcome, Harry Chapin. 514 00:27:28.267 --> 00:27:30.441 - Two, three, four. 515 00:27:46.009 --> 00:27:47.320 - It's you girl, 516 00:27:47.458 --> 00:27:50.116 you've put Rose colored glasses on my eyes 517 00:27:50.254 --> 00:27:52.636 and made the world a game. 518 00:27:52.774 --> 00:27:56.985 And everything I thought I knew, will never be the same. 519 00:27:57.123 --> 00:27:59.988 - This is a song about how I met my wife. 520 00:28:00.126 --> 00:28:02.577 I was giving guitar lessons back in the days 521 00:28:02.715 --> 00:28:04.027 where I used that as a social means 522 00:28:04.165 --> 00:28:05.856 to get girls into my room. 523 00:28:05.994 --> 00:28:08.203 And this one turned out a little more serious 524 00:28:08.341 --> 00:28:10.343 than I thought it would. 525 00:28:12.380 --> 00:28:14.347 - Out of the blue, actually, he called up 526 00:28:14.485 --> 00:28:18.904 and he said, "I hear you wanna take guitar lessons." 527 00:28:26.394 --> 00:28:28.189 - My wife had three kids when I've met her 528 00:28:28.327 --> 00:28:32.089 and we've had two sons by the normal methods. 529 00:28:32.227 --> 00:28:34.298 - They would share poems when they first met. 530 00:28:34.436 --> 00:28:36.231 It was supposedly for guitar lessons, 531 00:28:36.369 --> 00:28:38.820 but I think it moved to other things over the years. 532 00:28:44.274 --> 00:28:46.276 - Sometimes he called and said he was busy. 533 00:28:46.414 --> 00:28:51.005 Sometimes he just didn't show up and sometimes he did. 534 00:28:58.012 --> 00:28:59.116 We had a hot date. 535 00:28:59.254 --> 00:29:03.914 We went to Flame Steaks, for $1.99. 536 00:29:04.052 --> 00:29:08.298 - And he became on the scene more and more over time. 537 00:29:08.436 --> 00:29:11.750 It was a slow process of liking Harry. 538 00:29:12.923 --> 00:29:15.270 It took me a while to warm up to him. 539 00:29:15.408 --> 00:29:17.272 And I can remember the first time when I finally was, 540 00:29:17.410 --> 00:29:20.897 ah, you know, this person is in my life. 541 00:29:21.035 --> 00:29:24.107 He had this energy of a very, very young person. 542 00:29:24.245 --> 00:29:26.350 So for us, it was like just having another fun person 543 00:29:26.488 --> 00:29:28.180 around the house. 544 00:29:38.190 --> 00:29:41.227 - She made her wedding gown and it had one of those, 545 00:29:41.365 --> 00:29:42.953 I guess it was a Mandarin collar. 546 00:29:43.091 --> 00:29:46.267 She, in seed pearls, sewed I love Harry 547 00:29:47.268 --> 00:29:49.788 across the collar of her wedding dress. 548 00:29:58.866 --> 00:30:00.108 - They were a wonderful couple 549 00:30:00.246 --> 00:30:03.111 in that they were kind of yin and yang to each other. 550 00:30:03.249 --> 00:30:06.666 That he had the energy and he needed the attention, 551 00:30:06.805 --> 00:30:09.221 and he loved to be out in front. 552 00:30:09.359 --> 00:30:11.016 And mom was the idea person. 553 00:30:11.154 --> 00:30:13.432 She was really the thinker and the one 554 00:30:13.570 --> 00:30:15.675 that would come up with the ideas 555 00:30:15.814 --> 00:30:17.712 and throw some stuff out there. 556 00:30:17.850 --> 00:30:20.991 And then Harry would take that, grab it, and move with it. 557 00:30:21.129 --> 00:30:24.857 - Sandy, well, her influence on the music 558 00:30:24.995 --> 00:30:29.137 and on world hunger, she was 100% supportive. 559 00:30:31.174 --> 00:30:34.349 Probably more than supportive, she was encouraging. 560 00:30:34.487 --> 00:30:35.523 What a pair. 561 00:30:38.457 --> 00:30:40.769 - In terms of my wife, she's getting a PhD in education 562 00:30:40.908 --> 00:30:42.875 at Columbia, got her master's at Harvard 563 00:30:43.013 --> 00:30:45.844 and has the ability, I seem to go from tree to tree 564 00:30:45.982 --> 00:30:47.984 and she sees the forest. 565 00:30:53.230 --> 00:30:55.025 A recording of his own song, "Cat's in the Cradle," 566 00:30:55.163 --> 00:30:57.269 sold over 1 million copies as a single. 567 00:30:57.407 --> 00:30:58.857 - This is, as I said, a song that Harry 568 00:30:58.995 --> 00:31:01.825 and his wife Sandy collaborated on. 569 00:31:01.963 --> 00:31:04.345 - "Cat's in the Cradle," was a poem that my mom wrote, 570 00:31:04.483 --> 00:31:06.347 showed it to Harry as kind of, 571 00:31:06.485 --> 00:31:08.004 this is a lesson to be learned, 572 00:31:08.142 --> 00:31:09.419 and then he turned it into song. 573 00:31:09.557 --> 00:31:10.523 And they did that a lot. 574 00:31:10.661 --> 00:31:12.422 They shared things back and forth. 575 00:31:12.560 --> 00:31:15.494 - The first time we heard "Cat's in the Cradle," 576 00:31:15.632 --> 00:31:16.978 I remember that time. - Yeah. 577 00:31:17.116 --> 00:31:19.187 - Yeah, we were in the dressing room, 578 00:31:19.325 --> 00:31:21.534 he pulls up this wooden chair, sticks his foot on it. 579 00:31:21.672 --> 00:31:24.192 You know, "I got this song guys, 580 00:31:24.330 --> 00:31:25.780 "I think it's gonna be a hit." 581 00:31:25.918 --> 00:31:27.506 He started playing it, and it was like, Whoa. 582 00:31:27.644 --> 00:31:30.785 Everybody kind of said, yeah, that's, that's nice. 583 00:31:30.923 --> 00:31:33.892 That's, you know, something could happen with this. 584 00:31:34.030 --> 00:31:37.309 It was sort of number one there for a while. 585 00:31:37.447 --> 00:31:39.173 - I have some people around me that not only 586 00:31:39.311 --> 00:31:42.038 will give me criticism, but come up with very strong ideas. 587 00:31:42.176 --> 00:31:44.799 And the most one is, the most important one in my life 588 00:31:44.937 --> 00:31:47.836 is my wife who really came up with the basic concept 589 00:31:47.975 --> 00:31:50.943 and many of the key lines of this song. 590 00:31:51.081 --> 00:31:53.290 As Stravinsky once said, great artists steal, 591 00:31:53.428 --> 00:31:54.567 bad artists borrow. 592 00:31:54.705 --> 00:31:56.224 I'm desperately trying to be great artist 593 00:31:56.362 --> 00:31:58.330 so I stole this from my wife. 594 00:31:58.468 --> 00:31:59.848 It's called "Cats in the Cradle," 595 00:31:59.987 --> 00:32:01.333 and it's about my boy, Josh. 596 00:32:01.471 --> 00:32:04.439 - Yeah, He had a whole shtick in concert where he would, 597 00:32:04.577 --> 00:32:09.099 he would say it was about me and lie about its origins. 598 00:32:09.237 --> 00:32:12.689 - And frankly, the song scares me to death. 599 00:32:15.036 --> 00:32:19.558 - We don't know life's lessons until too late. 600 00:32:22.319 --> 00:32:24.425 - It became about, about all of us, 601 00:32:24.563 --> 00:32:25.667 I guess, in a way. 602 00:32:25.805 --> 00:32:27.117 - This is the tree house that Harry built, 603 00:32:27.255 --> 00:32:30.293 and the address of our tree house was 5J Locust Lane, 604 00:32:30.431 --> 00:32:31.846 hence the five Js. 605 00:32:53.178 --> 00:32:54.455 - He tried very hard to be at home 606 00:32:54.593 --> 00:32:55.732 as much as he could, 607 00:32:55.870 --> 00:32:58.977 but he also was on the road a tremendous amount. 608 00:32:59.115 --> 00:33:01.496 - Lusted to take advantage of whatever opportunities 609 00:33:01.634 --> 00:33:03.222 were out there and to make the most 610 00:33:03.360 --> 00:33:05.155 of every opportunity he got. 611 00:33:11.541 --> 00:33:14.061 - My dad was a fantastic dad. 612 00:33:14.199 --> 00:33:16.028 He was an action dad. 613 00:33:27.315 --> 00:33:31.699 - So many instances of the way that he touched people, 614 00:33:32.734 --> 00:33:36.014 we hear in all sorts of stories that come back. 615 00:33:41.295 --> 00:33:42.503 - And he would come home and say, okay, 616 00:33:42.641 --> 00:33:45.506 we're going to do this and you're gonna enjoy it 617 00:33:45.644 --> 00:33:47.301 and you're gonna thank me for it. 618 00:33:47.439 --> 00:33:48.923 He was like the ringleader. 619 00:33:51.581 --> 00:33:53.203 - I become a category. 620 00:33:53.341 --> 00:33:55.447 I mean, when they say a Chapin song, 621 00:33:55.585 --> 00:33:57.104 people know what you're talking about. 622 00:33:57.242 --> 00:33:59.106 - You really weren't cat's in the cradle-ing me back there? 623 00:33:59.244 --> 00:34:00.107 - Of course not. 624 00:34:24.165 --> 00:34:25.684 - I should have golfed with you sooner, dad. 625 00:34:25.822 --> 00:34:27.306 - I've never made the time. 626 00:34:27.444 --> 00:34:28.307 - Luke! 627 00:34:29.308 --> 00:34:30.689 - I need to call my son. 628 00:34:30.827 --> 00:34:32.277 - Where do you go home to? 629 00:34:32.415 --> 00:34:34.451 Where do you go and rest retreat? 630 00:34:34.589 --> 00:34:38.076 - Well, I go home to my home, my wife and five kids. 631 00:34:38.214 --> 00:34:41.562 I also go home to motel rooms, my writing pad. 632 00:34:41.700 --> 00:34:45.566 I also go home to airplanes and I also go home 633 00:34:45.704 --> 00:34:49.017 to rent-a-cars, and I also go home to Washington, 634 00:34:49.156 --> 00:34:50.605 World Hunger Year. 635 00:34:57.612 --> 00:35:00.512 - She's 22, she's gonna go off, do whatever she does. 636 00:35:00.650 --> 00:35:03.618 And then you see her at holidays for a few hours here. 637 00:35:03.756 --> 00:35:06.759 Maybe you steal a Saturday once in a while. 638 00:35:06.897 --> 00:35:10.763 Reminded me of the Harry Chapin song, "Cat's in the Cradle," 639 00:35:10.901 --> 00:35:14.422 which was a great old song from a great, great man. 640 00:35:14.560 --> 00:35:16.010 Great New Yorker too. 641 00:35:16.148 --> 00:35:17.425 - Hey, what's "Cat's in the Cradle?" 642 00:35:17.563 --> 00:35:20.221 That a song from the '70s, you've heard it. 643 00:35:28.850 --> 00:35:31.508 - Why don't you just play your "Cat's in the Cradle," video? 644 00:35:31.646 --> 00:35:34.235 - Oh, hey, son of a bitch, I love that song. 645 00:35:34.373 --> 00:35:35.340 That's got that nice message in it. 646 00:35:35.478 --> 00:35:36.272 - How are we doing? 647 00:35:36.410 --> 00:35:37.618 - Cat's in the Cradle. 648 00:35:37.756 --> 00:35:38.791 - Whoa, whoa, where are you going? 649 00:35:38.929 --> 00:35:40.207 - I'm gonna go play catch with my son 650 00:35:40.345 --> 00:35:43.106 before it gets too late like "Cat's in the Cradle." 651 00:35:43.244 --> 00:35:44.314 - That's all very "Cat's in the Cradle," 652 00:35:44.452 --> 00:35:45.626 I don't wanna get into it. 653 00:35:56.671 --> 00:36:00.744 - Here's this song that captivated me as a little kid. 654 00:36:00.882 --> 00:36:03.437 It stayed a current theme in my life 655 00:36:03.575 --> 00:36:05.335 hearing the early hip hop guys 656 00:36:05.473 --> 00:36:07.958 that were even impressed by it. 657 00:36:37.643 --> 00:36:38.989 - Now here's what comes 658 00:36:39.127 --> 00:36:43.891 that I call the exodus part of the song. 659 00:36:52.658 --> 00:36:54.108 You get these visions of Sal Mineo 660 00:36:54.246 --> 00:36:55.592 coming through the bull rings. 661 00:37:09.606 --> 00:37:10.780 - Donkey! 662 00:37:24.311 --> 00:37:28.694 - We knew, he was kind of on a mission. 663 00:37:37.565 --> 00:37:40.154 - Before I met Harry I met Tom 664 00:37:40.292 --> 00:37:41.914 and I did a radio show with him, 665 00:37:42.052 --> 00:37:43.606 I was doing a show called On this Rock 666 00:37:43.744 --> 00:37:45.435 for the ABC Radio Network. 667 00:37:45.573 --> 00:37:47.230 - I think the initial thing actually 668 00:37:47.368 --> 00:37:49.784 was Bill Ayres meeting Harry. 669 00:37:49.922 --> 00:37:51.234 - I was a Catholic priest at the time, 670 00:37:51.372 --> 00:37:53.271 which was a little strange to be doing rock roll show, 671 00:37:53.409 --> 00:37:56.377 but I thought it was a good idea. 672 00:37:58.655 --> 00:38:00.623 At the end of the show, Tom said to me, 673 00:38:00.761 --> 00:38:01.555 that was really good. 674 00:38:01.693 --> 00:38:02.866 He said, you ask good questions. 675 00:38:03.004 --> 00:38:04.696 You outta talk to my brother, he loves to talk. 676 00:38:04.834 --> 00:38:06.214 Good morning and welcome On this Rock. 677 00:38:06.353 --> 00:38:08.251 And we do have somebody who makes it happen. 678 00:38:08.389 --> 00:38:11.772 Not only musically, but in a whole lot of other ways. 679 00:38:11.910 --> 00:38:13.498 It's a great pleasure for me to do a show 680 00:38:13.636 --> 00:38:15.638 with a guy that I have tremendous respect for, 681 00:38:15.776 --> 00:38:17.364 but also a real love for. 682 00:38:17.502 --> 00:38:19.883 A great friend, Harry Chapin. 683 00:38:20.021 --> 00:38:21.782 - Well Bill, we talked so many times 684 00:38:21.920 --> 00:38:23.887 in a non-recorded situation. 685 00:38:24.025 --> 00:38:25.510 It's gonna be interesting to be here, 686 00:38:25.648 --> 00:38:27.408 captured on tape today. 687 00:38:35.658 --> 00:38:37.694 - He came on the show and he was great. 688 00:38:37.832 --> 00:38:41.767 And at the end of it, he said to me, that was really good. 689 00:38:41.905 --> 00:38:46.531 He said, you should come to my house for dinner. 690 00:38:56.713 --> 00:39:00.476 - I remember he said to me, even if I have to end up 691 00:39:00.614 --> 00:39:03.513 doing hand carvings in the tip of a toothpick, 692 00:39:03.651 --> 00:39:06.516 it has to be something nobody else has ever done. 693 00:39:15.007 --> 00:39:16.250 - If Harry was an inspiration to me, 694 00:39:16.388 --> 00:39:17.907 Bill was an inspiration to Harry. 695 00:39:24.396 --> 00:39:25.777 - The amazing thing about Why Hunger 696 00:39:25.915 --> 00:39:29.746 and about Bill and Harry is that sense of we. 697 00:39:39.929 --> 00:39:42.932 - So right away, they had that spirit, you know, 698 00:39:43.070 --> 00:39:44.796 that wanting to change things and make things better. 699 00:39:44.934 --> 00:39:47.661 That was a big part of his life. 700 00:39:52.459 --> 00:39:56.532 - The dreams, let's talk about our dreams. 701 00:40:12.996 --> 00:40:15.585 - We had a gathering of friends at our house. 702 00:40:15.723 --> 00:40:18.588 They were talking about what they've been doing in the '60s. 703 00:40:18.726 --> 00:40:21.695 And some had marched on Washington. 704 00:40:39.678 --> 00:40:41.818 - When we met for dinner, we started talking 705 00:40:41.956 --> 00:40:43.544 and I had an idea. 706 00:40:43.682 --> 00:40:45.822 I had come from the civil rights movement. 707 00:40:45.960 --> 00:40:47.375 I had marched with Dr. King. 708 00:40:47.514 --> 00:40:51.172 I believed that hunger and poverty were wrong. 709 00:40:54.659 --> 00:40:56.695 - One March on Washington doesn't change the world 710 00:40:56.833 --> 00:40:58.628 and how can you change the world? 711 00:40:58.766 --> 00:41:02.356 And then the subject came up that if you're going 712 00:41:02.494 --> 00:41:05.635 to make a difference, you pick something 713 00:41:05.773 --> 00:41:08.638 that's important enough to dedicate a lifetime. 714 00:41:22.687 --> 00:41:24.896 - I would say that my prime goal in life 715 00:41:25.034 --> 00:41:26.449 is to have an impact in that area. 716 00:41:26.587 --> 00:41:27.519 Why? 717 00:41:27.657 --> 00:41:29.417 Because it is the most basic area. 718 00:41:29.556 --> 00:41:31.730 The fact is hunger also involves ecology. 719 00:41:31.868 --> 00:41:33.042 It also involves energy. 720 00:41:33.180 --> 00:41:35.044 It also involves women's rights and about economics 721 00:41:35.182 --> 00:41:36.148 and about politics. 722 00:41:36.286 --> 00:41:39.807 It involves the future of our own kind. 723 00:41:39.945 --> 00:41:43.052 - So Harry was right, as he was right about so many things. 724 00:41:43.190 --> 00:41:44.847 There's no need for hunger. 725 00:41:44.985 --> 00:41:48.609 It's an abnormality in the human economic 726 00:41:48.747 --> 00:41:50.024 and political condition. 727 00:41:50.162 --> 00:41:51.267 It's a farce. 728 00:41:52.717 --> 00:41:55.858 - What they did was they knew something about people, 729 00:41:55.996 --> 00:41:58.170 they knew who they wanted to help. 730 00:41:58.308 --> 00:42:00.828 - They made a commitment over the years to spend the rest 731 00:42:00.966 --> 00:42:02.865 of our lives fighting poverty. 732 00:42:03.003 --> 00:42:04.936 - His philosophy about stuff, his feelings 733 00:42:05.074 --> 00:42:09.457 about the importance of solving these core issues, 734 00:42:09.596 --> 00:42:11.149 were really amazing. 735 00:42:19.295 --> 00:42:20.779 - The two of them had taken on the world. 736 00:42:20.917 --> 00:42:23.402 - Harry and I both recognized, right from the beginning, 737 00:42:23.541 --> 00:42:25.404 that if you want to solve hunger, 738 00:42:25.543 --> 00:42:26.164 you can't just feed people. 739 00:42:26.302 --> 00:42:27.717 That's the first step. 740 00:42:27.855 --> 00:42:30.444 And at the time that movement was just beginning, 741 00:42:30.582 --> 00:42:31.583 emergency food. 742 00:42:31.721 --> 00:42:33.102 And so we got into that. 743 00:42:33.240 --> 00:42:35.104 - You know, and it was right around the time 744 00:42:35.242 --> 00:42:36.657 of the Bangladesh concert. 745 00:42:36.795 --> 00:42:38.763 And I think they decided we could 746 00:42:38.901 --> 00:42:42.145 do a Bangladesh type concert for hunger. 747 00:42:49.981 --> 00:42:51.638 - Bill and Harry talking 748 00:42:51.776 --> 00:42:53.640 about the concert in Bangladesh. 749 00:42:53.778 --> 00:42:55.987 - So I said to Harry, why don't we do a 750 00:42:56.125 --> 00:42:58.921 kind of Bangladesh type concert, but make it for Africa. 751 00:42:59.059 --> 00:43:00.992 He said, "Great idea, I love it." 752 00:43:01.130 --> 00:43:03.132 So we went to the UN. 753 00:43:03.270 --> 00:43:04.754 He knew a guy at the UN, 754 00:43:04.892 --> 00:43:06.480 and the guy said, "Yeah, it's a great idea." 755 00:43:06.618 --> 00:43:08.724 - Bill, and I guess Harry, who I really didn't, 756 00:43:08.862 --> 00:43:10.864 it might even have been the first time I met Harry. 757 00:43:11.002 --> 00:43:13.591 And they explained to us that they 758 00:43:13.729 --> 00:43:15.558 were gonna do this concert. 759 00:43:15.696 --> 00:43:17.629 - And we had several, several meetings, 760 00:43:17.767 --> 00:43:20.218 but it never worked out. 761 00:43:32.230 --> 00:43:35.785 - They began to realize a couple of things. 762 00:43:35.923 --> 00:43:38.236 First of all, this is a world that can feed itself. 763 00:43:38.374 --> 00:43:42.689 And second of all, that a concert wasn't gonna do it. 764 00:43:42.827 --> 00:43:46.831 Something had to be here today, next week, 765 00:43:46.969 --> 00:43:51.076 a month from now, a year from now, 10 years from now. 766 00:43:51.214 --> 00:43:52.802 And in the course of that, 767 00:43:52.940 --> 00:43:54.597 they decided we really need an organization 768 00:43:54.735 --> 00:43:56.772 that is just working on this. 769 00:43:56.910 --> 00:43:59.637 And Bill and Harry said, we could do this. 770 00:44:10.233 --> 00:44:13.236 - We've had some fantastic bombs, 771 00:44:13.374 --> 00:44:15.929 in terms of some concerts that we tried to plan 772 00:44:16.067 --> 00:44:17.137 that didn't come off. 773 00:44:17.275 --> 00:44:19.035 But we've done, how many, about 50 concerts? 774 00:44:19.173 --> 00:44:22.694 - Yeah, Yeah, well, the thing, Bill, is as you have said, 775 00:44:22.832 --> 00:44:24.938 and I, I mean, it's a thing that I believe in strongly 776 00:44:25.076 --> 00:44:28.148 that if you're serious about something you're not looking 777 00:44:28.286 --> 00:44:30.081 for the one march, the one concert. 778 00:44:30.219 --> 00:44:33.671 That you're involved on a day to day basis, 779 00:44:33.809 --> 00:44:35.534 you here today, tomorrow, next week, next month, 780 00:44:35.673 --> 00:44:37.640 next year, 10 years from now. 781 00:44:37.778 --> 00:44:40.160 - I didn't know Bill enough or Harry, 782 00:44:40.298 --> 00:44:42.231 to know that that's what they did. 783 00:44:42.369 --> 00:44:43.335 They did the impossible. 784 00:44:43.473 --> 00:44:45.717 - He was in a hurry to do everything, 785 00:44:45.855 --> 00:44:49.756 make everything he could happen, you know. 786 00:44:49.894 --> 00:44:53.656 And literally believed that through his efforts 787 00:44:53.794 --> 00:44:56.866 and the efforts, if he could get the politicians involved, 788 00:44:57.004 --> 00:44:59.213 he could eliminate these issues of hunger 789 00:44:59.351 --> 00:45:01.215 and homelessness and poverty. 790 00:45:01.353 --> 00:45:02.872 - Let's talk about our dreams here. 791 00:45:03.010 --> 00:45:04.218 - Well, it's an interesting time. 792 00:45:04.356 --> 00:45:06.186 I hope they don't forget the fact 793 00:45:06.324 --> 00:45:08.671 that what America truly stands for is not B1 Bombers. 794 00:45:08.809 --> 00:45:11.087 What makes us unique is human rights, 795 00:45:11.225 --> 00:45:13.572 human needs and human dignity. 796 00:45:13.711 --> 00:45:14.746 - Not so bad. 797 00:45:16.368 --> 00:45:17.922 - Wow, looks great! 798 00:45:18.060 --> 00:45:21.822 It's interesting to look back to the 1970s 799 00:45:21.960 --> 00:45:24.791 into the friendship that Bill and Harry had 800 00:45:24.929 --> 00:45:27.000 and the vision that they shared, 801 00:45:27.138 --> 00:45:30.797 and how active they were in Washington, DC. 802 00:45:37.527 --> 00:45:39.253 - He's really looking for commonality. 803 00:45:39.391 --> 00:45:41.635 He was trying to figure out what the biggest issues were, 804 00:45:41.773 --> 00:45:43.257 who wanted to be involved in the biggest issues, 805 00:45:43.395 --> 00:45:46.191 and how they could work together for a solution. 806 00:45:46.329 --> 00:45:50.368 - I loved when Bill and Harry would come in. 807 00:45:50.506 --> 00:45:53.267 One would be the crashing surf, 808 00:45:54.130 --> 00:45:56.684 the other would be the gentle stream. 809 00:45:56.823 --> 00:45:59.722 But both delivered the message. 810 00:45:59.860 --> 00:46:01.724 - And I think when he and Bill met, 811 00:46:01.862 --> 00:46:03.277 they were both very positive people 812 00:46:03.415 --> 00:46:05.901 who believed in the power of possibility. 813 00:46:06.039 --> 00:46:09.421 And neither of them, not just wouldn't take no 814 00:46:09.559 --> 00:46:11.734 for an answer, they didn't think that no really existed 815 00:46:11.872 --> 00:46:13.046 in the hearts of other people, 816 00:46:13.184 --> 00:46:15.324 because the two of them were such yes people. 817 00:46:15.462 --> 00:46:17.326 And in that sense sometimes I think Sandy 818 00:46:17.464 --> 00:46:20.225 and I both married a preacher. 819 00:46:20.363 --> 00:46:22.538 - His political sensibility 820 00:46:23.470 --> 00:46:27.163 was also kind of prophetic and timeless. 821 00:46:33.135 --> 00:46:34.930 - So we started knocking on doors. 822 00:46:35.068 --> 00:46:36.207 And Harry was very persuasive. 823 00:46:36.345 --> 00:46:37.415 He walked in like this and say, 824 00:46:37.553 --> 00:46:40.142 I got this presidential commission, why 825 00:46:40.280 --> 00:46:43.110 - He had entree on a lot of different levels 826 00:46:43.248 --> 00:46:44.491 and he would use them. 827 00:46:44.629 --> 00:46:46.907 And it's not as if he would say hello and greet them. 828 00:46:47.045 --> 00:46:51.084 He would say, hello, and say, what are you doing? 829 00:46:51.222 --> 00:46:55.088 - Well we thought 52, I guess we had 52, 53. 830 00:46:55.226 --> 00:46:58.022 - And we have a number of people who have not signed it, 831 00:46:58.160 --> 00:47:00.403 who have said that if it comes to a vote, 832 00:47:00.541 --> 00:47:02.060 they'll vote for it. 833 00:47:02.198 --> 00:47:04.407 And they also will not do anything to stop it 834 00:47:04.545 --> 00:47:06.375 from going up on the unanimous consent. 835 00:47:06.513 --> 00:47:09.378 - Well we got, I think just I this morning from Chicago, 836 00:47:09.516 --> 00:47:11.173 called a bunch of senators. 837 00:47:11.311 --> 00:47:13.934 - But Baker said that he wouldn't. 838 00:47:14.072 --> 00:47:17.006 - We're gonna share some songs here for a little while. 839 00:47:17.144 --> 00:47:18.905 - Do you know who he is? 840 00:47:19.043 --> 00:47:20.044 This is my brother, Harry Chapin. 841 00:47:25.428 --> 00:47:26.464 - I think if there was some way 842 00:47:26.602 --> 00:47:29.916 that we could harness Harry's energy, 843 00:47:31.089 --> 00:47:34.437 we could solve all the problems in the world: 844 00:47:34.575 --> 00:47:39.511 energy problem, world food problems and everything else. 845 00:47:39.649 --> 00:47:42.342 Harry and I have become quite friendly, 846 00:47:42.480 --> 00:47:45.828 worked very closely together on the whole question 847 00:47:45.966 --> 00:47:47.347 of world food. 848 00:47:47.485 --> 00:47:50.315 He's been in my office nearly daily 849 00:47:51.385 --> 00:47:53.146 and then he's off to somewhere like California 850 00:47:53.284 --> 00:47:54.457 for the afternoon or evening, 851 00:47:54.595 --> 00:47:56.459 and is back again later in the same day. 852 00:47:56.597 --> 00:47:59.290 - I bought what Henry Kissinger said in 1974 853 00:47:59.428 --> 00:48:01.119 at the World Food Conference, and he said, 854 00:48:01.257 --> 00:48:03.535 I think it indicate the focus that Harry 855 00:48:03.673 --> 00:48:06.953 and others want to place on the resolution. 856 00:48:07.091 --> 00:48:09.403 Now, passing a resolution itself does nothing. 857 00:48:09.541 --> 00:48:11.543 - About the commission, because it's asked 858 00:48:11.681 --> 00:48:13.269 to answer difficult questions 859 00:48:13.407 --> 00:48:16.203 about the United States policies affecting hunger. 860 00:48:16.341 --> 00:48:17.895 We're asking, what are we doing? 861 00:48:18.033 --> 00:48:19.310 Can we do it better? 862 00:48:19.448 --> 00:48:21.346 And can we do more? 863 00:48:40.538 --> 00:48:43.127 - We actually were able to get a majority 864 00:48:43.265 --> 00:48:47.234 of congressmen to sign on to this and vote to say yes. 865 00:48:47.372 --> 00:48:49.788 And then named Harry as one of the members 866 00:48:49.927 --> 00:48:50.997 of the commission. 867 00:48:51.135 --> 00:48:52.895 - What is unique about this person? 868 00:48:53.033 --> 00:48:54.862 What is it that when they walk in the room, 869 00:48:55.001 --> 00:48:56.485 they dominate the room? 870 00:48:56.623 --> 00:48:59.488 Everything changes, there's a whole different energy 871 00:48:59.626 --> 00:49:02.180 in the room and dynamic and karma 872 00:49:02.318 --> 00:49:03.941 or whatever you wanna call it. 873 00:49:04.079 --> 00:49:06.081 And Harry was one of those people. 874 00:49:06.219 --> 00:49:08.911 And I saw that the first moment I met with him. 875 00:49:14.261 --> 00:49:17.333 - You guys don't do bad after you're pushed a little. 876 00:49:17.471 --> 00:49:19.611 Same way by Congress, I tell you, same thing. 877 00:49:19.749 --> 00:49:22.235 - What a lovely man and how right was he? 878 00:49:22.373 --> 00:49:24.927 But he lobbied to nicely in Congress. 879 00:49:25.065 --> 00:49:28.241 You know, those fuckers are up for election every two years, 880 00:49:28.379 --> 00:49:29.552 take them out. 881 00:49:30.691 --> 00:49:32.866 They're so vulnerable. 882 00:49:33.004 --> 00:49:34.385 - He called me one day and he said, 883 00:49:34.523 --> 00:49:35.903 "We're going to the White House." 884 00:49:36.042 --> 00:49:40.046 Carter had invited a whole bunch of record company people. 885 00:49:40.184 --> 00:49:42.980 They got the idea that we had about doing a concert. 886 00:49:43.118 --> 00:49:44.464 So Harry said, "You gotta get dressed up." 887 00:49:44.602 --> 00:49:46.293 I said, "Me get dressed up? 888 00:49:46.431 --> 00:49:47.501 "You got to get dressed up." 889 00:49:47.639 --> 00:49:48.847 "Oh no, wait until you see it," he said, 890 00:49:48.986 --> 00:49:50.194 "Sandy bought me a new suit." 891 00:49:50.332 --> 00:49:51.333 Oh, okay. 892 00:49:51.471 --> 00:49:52.437 - I walk in the white house, right? 893 00:49:52.575 --> 00:49:54.060 I dropped a piece of paper. 894 00:49:54.198 --> 00:49:56.614 I leaned down, I go, 895 00:49:56.752 --> 00:50:00.376 My pants are ripped from here all the way through to here. 896 00:50:00.514 --> 00:50:02.516 So for the rest of the day, I'm going like. 897 00:50:02.654 --> 00:50:04.242 Can you imagine the secret service men watching me, 898 00:50:04.380 --> 00:50:05.554 I'm going like this. 899 00:50:07.556 --> 00:50:08.626 Incredible. 900 00:50:09.627 --> 00:50:10.938 - Meeting was not going too well 901 00:50:11.077 --> 00:50:12.871 and these record company guys are going, buh, buh, buh. 902 00:50:13.010 --> 00:50:14.114 Harry stands up and he says, 903 00:50:14.252 --> 00:50:16.358 "I've been pedaling my rear end for hunger 904 00:50:16.496 --> 00:50:17.704 "for all these years." 905 00:50:17.842 --> 00:50:20.017 And he turns around and he shows them. 906 00:50:20.155 --> 00:50:21.811 - I met Harry in 1978. 907 00:50:23.054 --> 00:50:24.297 I was in the studio. 908 00:50:24.435 --> 00:50:27.472 He was making a record in another studio. 909 00:50:27.610 --> 00:50:31.304 And he came smiling up to me and started talking to me. 910 00:50:31.442 --> 00:50:35.170 And 20 minutes went by, 30 minutes went by. 911 00:50:36.447 --> 00:50:39.553 We talked about everything, politics, music. 912 00:50:39.691 --> 00:50:41.038 Yeah, he's a nice guy. 913 00:50:41.176 --> 00:50:42.694 - This was true about Harry, he loved to talk. 914 00:50:42.832 --> 00:50:45.111 - Not only would he leave the room in the middle 915 00:50:45.249 --> 00:50:46.698 of one of your sentences, he'd leave the room 916 00:50:46.836 --> 00:50:48.528 in the middle of one of his sentences. 917 00:50:48.666 --> 00:50:52.980 His mind was always two minutes ahead of what was going on. 918 00:50:53.119 --> 00:50:56.018 - He'd be walking along and you'd be running. 919 00:50:56.156 --> 00:50:58.193 - I couldn't keep up with Harry Chapin. 920 00:50:58.331 --> 00:51:00.954 Harry Chapman was in a hurry about everything in his life. 921 00:51:01.092 --> 00:51:01.989 - Whose pencil did I steal here? 922 00:51:02.128 --> 00:51:03.439 - He had a kind of leadership 923 00:51:03.577 --> 00:51:05.614 that I always called the Pied Piper. 924 00:51:05.752 --> 00:51:07.478 - Mr. Chapin, you said something in your concert 925 00:51:07.616 --> 00:51:11.482 about world hunger, about you helping with that. 926 00:51:11.620 --> 00:51:13.484 And I don't think that's much of a problem 927 00:51:13.622 --> 00:51:16.590 because I feel if we can just improve agriculture 928 00:51:16.728 --> 00:51:18.282 in the underdeveloped countries, 929 00:51:18.420 --> 00:51:20.560 that ought to be sufficient to help it. 930 00:51:20.698 --> 00:51:22.493 - Well, it's interesting, you know, 931 00:51:22.631 --> 00:51:24.736 one of the things we're trying to make people aware of 932 00:51:24.874 --> 00:51:27.222 both for World Hunger Year, which we founded five years ago 933 00:51:27.360 --> 00:51:28.982 on the president's commission on world hunger, 934 00:51:29.120 --> 00:51:30.363 which I'm a member of, is the fact 935 00:51:30.501 --> 00:51:32.641 that there's so many myths about hunger. 936 00:51:32.779 --> 00:51:34.298 And one of them is that we got too many people 937 00:51:34.436 --> 00:51:35.678 and not enough food. 938 00:51:35.816 --> 00:51:37.163 And if we just grow enough food 939 00:51:37.301 --> 00:51:40.373 and stop the population expansion that we 940 00:51:40.511 --> 00:51:43.514 But this is belied very clearly by a country that you may 941 00:51:43.652 --> 00:51:45.412 have heard of called the United States of America. 942 00:51:45.550 --> 00:51:47.345 - I live in the Bronx. 943 00:51:47.483 --> 00:51:50.624 The Bronx, out of 62 counties in New York state, 944 00:51:50.762 --> 00:51:54.421 the Bronx ranks 62 as the most unhealthiest. 945 00:51:54.559 --> 00:51:55.767 Yeah, so this is the garden of happiness 946 00:51:55.905 --> 00:51:58.218 and this is the 30th year. 947 00:51:58.356 --> 00:52:00.496 So I tell people that if you were sad, 948 00:52:00.634 --> 00:52:04.707 not feeling well, when you come in here, you'll see, 949 00:52:04.845 --> 00:52:06.226 you'll feel happy. 950 00:52:06.364 --> 00:52:08.228 So that's why we call it the garden of happiness. 951 00:52:08.366 --> 00:52:10.161 It's a valley of love for me. 952 00:52:10.299 --> 00:52:11.576 I enjoy the people here. 953 00:52:11.714 --> 00:52:14.614 I enjoy waking up in the morning to hear the birds sing. 954 00:52:14.752 --> 00:52:16.167 I enjoy nature. 955 00:52:16.926 --> 00:52:21.414 And most of all, I enjoy the people and the children. 956 00:52:22.760 --> 00:52:24.486 - I mean, the fact is we've had hunger 957 00:52:24.624 --> 00:52:26.281 all the way through human history and there's some things 958 00:52:26.419 --> 00:52:27.558 that we're gonna have to do about it. 959 00:52:27.696 --> 00:52:29.007 - Some basic changes. 960 00:52:29.146 --> 00:52:30.457 - Right? 961 00:52:30.595 --> 00:52:31.941 - And some of those are political and economic. 962 00:52:32.079 --> 00:52:34.323 - And people have to be aware of what they can do 963 00:52:34.461 --> 00:52:36.222 or how these things could caused. 964 00:52:36.360 --> 00:52:38.293 Many of the economic dislocations in this country 965 00:52:38.431 --> 00:52:40.053 right now, they're causing hardship for some people 966 00:52:40.191 --> 00:52:41.710 have a basis in the same thing 967 00:52:41.848 --> 00:52:43.505 that are making people starve in other countries. 968 00:52:43.643 --> 00:52:47.474 - And so this is quote unquote, a low income neighborhood. 969 00:52:47.612 --> 00:52:50.753 But for me, it's not about being about low income, 970 00:52:50.891 --> 00:52:52.583 marginalized or poor. 971 00:52:52.721 --> 00:52:54.688 It's about changing the lens of those 972 00:52:54.826 --> 00:52:59.383 that have been the victim of politics, of racism, 973 00:52:59.521 --> 00:53:01.937 in terms of hunger and poverty. 974 00:53:16.538 --> 00:53:18.195 - You can fool people for a amount of time, 975 00:53:18.333 --> 00:53:21.267 but in the long run, if you wanted to know where America was 976 00:53:21.405 --> 00:53:24.684 in the '60s, you have to listen to Dylan, to the Beatles, 977 00:53:24.822 --> 00:53:27.445 to Paul Simon, to Crosby, Stills, Nash, and Young. 978 00:53:27.583 --> 00:53:30.483 You do not need, look at the top 20 albums, 979 00:53:30.621 --> 00:53:32.139 you do not need listen to those albums 980 00:53:32.278 --> 00:53:33.313 to know where America-- 981 00:53:33.451 --> 00:53:34.521 - With a couple of exceptions. 982 00:53:34.659 --> 00:53:35.350 - Okay, well I think one of them, 983 00:53:35.488 --> 00:53:36.627 you were about to mention. 984 00:53:36.765 --> 00:53:37.766 - Yeah, absolutely, Bruce Springsteen, 985 00:53:37.904 --> 00:53:39.043 I think is a very good example of that. 986 00:53:39.181 --> 00:53:41.321 - I wouldn't say Bruce necessarily missed meals, 987 00:53:41.459 --> 00:53:45.463 but I think it was part of a thin margin. 988 00:53:45.601 --> 00:53:49.087 - Next night I came in, Harry comes bounding up smiling, 989 00:53:49.226 --> 00:53:51.538 and he starts talking to me. 990 00:53:51.676 --> 00:53:54.334 30 minutes goes by, so finally, 991 00:53:55.508 --> 00:53:58.027 I used to try to hide from him. 992 00:53:59.960 --> 00:54:01.514 I'd come in and I'd ask the secretary 993 00:54:01.652 --> 00:54:04.310 if Harry was in the lobby. 994 00:54:04.448 --> 00:54:06.829 Then I'd sneak in the studio. 995 00:54:06.967 --> 00:54:08.659 - I guess I've been known for the last three 996 00:54:08.797 --> 00:54:09.901 or four years of the most politically 997 00:54:10.039 --> 00:54:13.836 and socially active performer in America. 998 00:54:13.974 --> 00:54:15.873 I found a lot of music critics are wishing I'd spend 999 00:54:16.011 --> 00:54:17.737 more time in politics and a lot of politicians 1000 00:54:17.875 --> 00:54:19.739 that wished that I was spending more time in music. 1001 00:54:19.877 --> 00:54:22.259 But anyway, or at least suggesting that I do. 1002 00:54:22.397 --> 00:54:26.124 - He chose what he chose, and the day that he chose it, 1003 00:54:26.263 --> 00:54:28.437 he threw down everything he had. 1004 00:54:28.575 --> 00:54:30.750 - That's also part of the Harry and Bill thing, 1005 00:54:30.888 --> 00:54:32.648 which is they're interested in the work. 1006 00:54:32.786 --> 00:54:34.685 And we said, how do we get this done? 1007 00:54:34.823 --> 00:54:36.203 How do we help? 1008 00:54:36.342 --> 00:54:37.722 And how do we make this move forward 1009 00:54:37.860 --> 00:54:40.207 and move this increment, you know, really, 1010 00:54:40.346 --> 00:54:41.899 really help this situation. 1011 00:54:42.037 --> 00:54:44.522 - Is the idea of a participatory democracy outmoded? 1012 00:54:44.660 --> 00:54:47.284 Is the American dream outmoded? 1013 00:54:48.354 --> 00:54:50.942 - As far as his sense of citizenship, 1014 00:54:51.080 --> 00:54:55.430 his sense of patriotism, you look at words he said, 1015 00:54:55.568 --> 00:54:57.949 words he wrote 30-odd years ago 1016 00:54:58.087 --> 00:55:01.090 and they ring out beautifully today. 1017 00:55:02.506 --> 00:55:06.233 - I think the thing that makes all of us want to be alive, 1018 00:55:06.372 --> 00:55:07.718 it's to matter. 1019 00:55:07.856 --> 00:55:09.478 And the way you matter is to care enough about something 1020 00:55:09.616 --> 00:55:10.721 so you keep doing it. 1021 00:55:10.859 --> 00:55:12.516 - Harry and Bill were ahead of their time 1022 00:55:12.654 --> 00:55:14.518 because really what happened 1023 00:55:14.656 --> 00:55:15.829 when they started the organization, 1024 00:55:15.967 --> 00:55:17.935 there was like a hundred soup kitchens and pantries 1025 00:55:18.073 --> 00:55:20.455 in New York city, now there's 1300. 1026 00:55:20.593 --> 00:55:22.215 There's no less hunger. 1027 00:55:22.353 --> 00:55:25.322 So they always had a root cause approach 1028 00:55:25.460 --> 00:55:29.843 to look at the systems and structures that 1029 00:55:29.981 --> 00:55:32.536 What is at that intersection? 1030 00:55:32.674 --> 00:55:35.435 which we, at Why Hunger, define as social justice. 1031 00:55:35.573 --> 00:55:38.611 You have to solve hunger by looking at poverty, 1032 00:55:38.749 --> 00:55:41.372 by looking at a social justice. 1033 00:55:41.510 --> 00:55:45.687 And when you do that, there are plenty of people out there, 1034 00:55:45.825 --> 00:55:47.792 and this is what makes me hopeful, 1035 00:55:47.930 --> 00:55:52.590 that we can live the vision that Bill and Harry charted 1036 00:55:52.728 --> 00:55:54.143 so many years ago. 1037 00:55:55.731 --> 00:55:57.699 - Harry's pumping the crowds, "Are you ready?" 1038 00:55:57.837 --> 00:55:59.908 You know, "Are you ready?" 1039 00:56:00.046 --> 00:56:01.288 - Are you ready? 1040 00:56:01.427 --> 00:56:04.671 - Since it's halftime and Harry's in the toilet, 1041 00:56:04.809 --> 00:56:08.295 you know, in the dumper and here's them come in. 1042 00:56:08.434 --> 00:56:09.538 And hears them talking about him. 1043 00:56:09.676 --> 00:56:10.677 And it's Wallace, and says, 1044 00:56:10.815 --> 00:56:12.472 "If I hear one more freaking time." 1045 00:56:12.610 --> 00:56:13.646 - "Are you ready?" 1046 00:56:13.784 --> 00:56:14.854 - "Are you ready?" 1047 00:56:14.992 --> 00:56:15.751 Are you ready? 1048 00:56:15.889 --> 00:56:16.649 - "Are you ready?" 1049 00:56:16.787 --> 00:56:17.788 - For every song. 1050 00:56:17.926 --> 00:56:19.514 - Are you ready? 1051 00:56:19.652 --> 00:56:22.689 - Back in the cheap seats, they're ready. 1052 00:56:22.827 --> 00:56:24.381 - Barking at halftime or whatever, 1053 00:56:24.519 --> 00:56:26.003 I'm mumbling and cursing under my breath. 1054 00:56:26.141 --> 00:56:27.694 You know? 1055 00:56:27.832 --> 00:56:29.558 And I thought I heard a little rustle in the stall 1056 00:56:29.696 --> 00:56:32.389 or something, but you know, took a leak or whatever, 1057 00:56:32.527 --> 00:56:34.908 I'm still cursing and mumbling, that son of a bitch 1058 00:56:35.046 --> 00:56:37.463 and are you ready and other bullshit. 1059 00:56:37.601 --> 00:56:39.396 - I say the funniest thing about Harry, 1060 00:56:39.534 --> 00:56:40.466 so Harry, what'd you do? 1061 00:56:40.604 --> 00:56:41.812 He says, "I pulled my legs up." 1062 00:56:41.950 --> 00:56:43.434 Which is the funniest thing I've ever heard. 1063 00:56:43.572 --> 00:56:45.816 Anybody else would've said, "I can hear you, Big John." 1064 00:56:45.954 --> 00:56:46.989 You know, it'd be like that. 1065 00:56:47.127 --> 00:56:48.508 But instead, I pulled my legs up. 1066 00:56:48.646 --> 00:56:50.303 I said, that's what a man. 1067 00:56:50.441 --> 00:56:51.787 - He never said a word until-- 1068 00:56:51.925 --> 00:56:52.995 - Never said a word. 1069 00:56:53.133 --> 00:56:54.549 The second half he's doing the same shit. 1070 00:56:54.687 --> 00:56:55.722 Are you ready? 1071 00:56:55.860 --> 00:56:57.068 Are you ready? 1072 00:56:57.206 --> 00:56:58.587 At one point, he turns around with this big smile 1073 00:56:58.725 --> 00:57:03.592 on his face, "Are you ready Big John?." 1074 00:57:03.730 --> 00:57:05.629 - So we went out to California to mix. 1075 00:57:05.767 --> 00:57:10.323 I'm standing on this balcony, third floor of this motel. 1076 00:57:10.461 --> 00:57:12.877 And I hear, "Hey, hey." 1077 00:57:13.015 --> 00:57:15.501 I looked down and there's Harry. 1078 00:57:16.674 --> 00:57:18.365 And he starts talking to me. 1079 00:57:19.781 --> 00:57:22.024 - Talks to me for that 40 minutes, 1080 00:57:22.162 --> 00:57:24.855 standing down there looking up. 1081 00:57:24.993 --> 00:57:26.753 He was trying to get me to do something. 1082 00:57:26.891 --> 00:57:31.620 - Ralph Nader had called Jann Wenner and said, you know, 1083 00:57:31.758 --> 00:57:34.761 this guy, Harry Chapin is like the most effective person 1084 00:57:34.899 --> 00:57:37.108 I've ever seen on Capitol Hill. 1085 00:57:37.246 --> 00:57:38.869 - They should say to me what music can be 1086 00:57:39.007 --> 00:57:43.667 is that synthesis of magic and meaning that, well, 1087 00:57:43.805 --> 00:57:47.118 no other art form, I think, does so well. 1088 00:57:58.164 --> 00:58:00.718 - I love that song, and it was a very appropriate 1089 00:58:00.856 --> 00:58:04.584 entry here at this point, because just at this very moment 1090 00:58:04.722 --> 00:58:07.863 in walks brother Tom, who plays lead guitar on that. 1091 00:58:08.001 --> 00:58:08.968 How you doing Tom? 1092 00:58:09.106 --> 00:58:10.625 - Good, Bill, good to see you. 1093 00:58:10.763 --> 00:58:11.936 - And not only good plays lead guitar, 1094 00:58:12.074 --> 00:58:14.560 but also has helped enormously in this venture 1095 00:58:14.698 --> 00:58:16.113 that Harry and I just been talking about, 1096 00:58:16.251 --> 00:58:17.459 the World Hunger stuff. 1097 00:58:17.597 --> 00:58:19.047 You have bailed us out any number of times. 1098 00:58:19.185 --> 00:58:21.118 - My band calls Tom the benefit band, 1099 00:58:21.256 --> 00:58:23.603 because every time I need somebody to do 1100 00:58:23.741 --> 00:58:24.708 Tom is out there with me. 1101 00:58:24.846 --> 00:58:26.572 - Yeah, that's great. 1102 00:58:26.710 --> 00:58:28.401 - It's part of what he wanted to do. 1103 00:58:28.539 --> 00:58:29.885 He was trying to raise as much as he could. 1104 00:58:30.023 --> 00:58:33.855 - From daddy's speech on volunteerism, 1105 00:58:33.993 --> 00:58:36.167 we must all go that extra mile. 1106 00:58:36.305 --> 00:58:39.516 We must be aggressive in the sense of challenging others 1107 00:58:39.654 --> 00:58:43.071 and making them realize that the American dream implies 1108 00:58:43.209 --> 00:58:46.695 that all of us must be actively involved. 1109 00:58:47.731 --> 00:58:49.595 We all have the potential to move the world 1110 00:58:49.733 --> 00:58:52.494 and the world is ready to be moved. 1111 00:58:52.632 --> 00:58:55.670 - And I really do think that people like Pete Seeger 1112 00:58:55.808 --> 00:58:59.156 inspired him and you know, obviously my mother, 1113 00:58:59.294 --> 00:59:00.744 and Bill and others. 1114 00:59:00.882 --> 00:59:05.542 And I think that anybody who is able to accomplish something 1115 00:59:05.680 --> 00:59:07.958 hopes that it doesn't end and that it continues, 1116 00:59:08.096 --> 00:59:11.030 but that relies on other people to also be inspired, 1117 00:59:11.168 --> 00:59:13.584 to be passionate, to be committed. 1118 00:59:13.722 --> 00:59:15.482 - What we wanna talk about tonight 1119 00:59:15.621 --> 00:59:18.002 is this whole business of changing the world. 1120 00:59:18.140 --> 00:59:19.486 We got into that last week. 1121 00:59:19.625 --> 00:59:21.454 I take small topics like that, you know me, right? 1122 00:59:21.592 --> 00:59:24.146 The topic that we'd like to get into 1123 00:59:24.284 --> 00:59:28.599 is not only hunger, but your attitude towards society 1124 00:59:28.737 --> 00:59:30.463 and your role within it. 1125 00:59:30.601 --> 00:59:32.707 Whether you think you have any possibility 1126 00:59:32.845 --> 00:59:34.225 of changing anything, 1127 00:59:34.363 --> 00:59:35.882 maybe you've gotten a little bit cynical. 1128 00:59:36.020 --> 00:59:36.883 Do you think so? 1129 00:59:37.021 --> 00:59:38.471 Do you think that the two of us 1130 00:59:38.609 --> 00:59:39.714 are absolutely out of our minds? 1131 00:59:39.852 --> 00:59:41.819 I mean, some of our friends think we are. 1132 00:59:41.957 --> 00:59:43.718 - Yeah, some of our friends are probably right. 1133 00:59:52.071 --> 00:59:53.693 - One of my favorite stories about Harry 1134 00:59:53.831 --> 00:59:56.765 is taking him to a Laker game in 1980 on election night. 1135 00:59:56.903 --> 00:59:59.216 - I was in a limo with Ken Kragen and Harry 1136 00:59:59.354 --> 01:00:02.633 outside the Forum in Inglewood, California, 1137 01:00:02.771 --> 01:00:04.497 and I was really excited, 1138 01:00:04.635 --> 01:00:06.188 being a New York Knicks fan all life 1139 01:00:06.326 --> 01:00:08.121 to sit courtside at the Lakers. 1140 01:00:08.259 --> 01:00:10.123 We get to the game, and it's a little surreal, 1141 01:00:10.261 --> 01:00:11.918 because we're down to the courtside 1142 01:00:12.056 --> 01:00:13.023 and Jack Nicholson's there, 1143 01:00:13.161 --> 01:00:14.645 and it's the Lakers in the Forum. 1144 01:00:14.783 --> 01:00:17.061 It's kind of fun, but there's this ominous feeling. 1145 01:00:17.199 --> 01:00:19.546 - Right now Jimmy Carter's preparing 1146 01:00:19.685 --> 01:00:22.066 to get into the presidential limousine. 1147 01:00:22.204 --> 01:00:24.724 He will be making his concession speech. 1148 01:00:24.862 --> 01:00:28.141 - And I'm sitting with Harry during the game. 1149 01:00:28.279 --> 01:00:31.766 We have been in the back room watching television 1150 01:00:31.904 --> 01:00:34.872 and what was happening in the election. 1151 01:00:35.010 --> 01:00:38.151 - I promised you four years ago 1152 01:00:38.289 --> 01:00:41.292 that I would never lie to you. 1153 01:00:41.430 --> 01:00:45.745 So I can't stand here tonight and say it doesn't hurt. 1154 01:00:45.883 --> 01:00:47.885 - And suddenly he said to me, you know what? 1155 01:00:48.023 --> 01:00:50.923 I've lost most of the Democrats that were my supporters 1156 01:00:51.061 --> 01:00:54.098 on stuff I was trying to get done on the issues 1157 01:00:54.236 --> 01:00:56.722 of hunger and homelessness and poverty. 1158 01:00:56.860 --> 01:01:00.864 - The president pledged the utmost in cooperation 1159 01:01:01.002 --> 01:01:03.694 in the transition that will take place. 1160 01:01:03.832 --> 01:01:05.178 - I'm gonna have to leave right now, 1161 01:01:05.316 --> 01:01:06.593 I'm going to fly to Washington immediately. 1162 01:01:06.732 --> 01:01:09.320 And they ran on an anti-crime platform. 1163 01:01:09.458 --> 01:01:12.738 I'm going to show them how the reduction in those issues 1164 01:01:12.876 --> 01:01:16.776 can really affect what they want to accomplish. 1165 01:01:18.882 --> 01:01:21.194 - Reagan wasn't interested in any of this. 1166 01:01:27.269 --> 01:01:31.618 Harry and I sat in his house just a few miles from here. 1167 01:01:31.757 --> 01:01:34.069 And we went in tears saying, you know, 1168 01:01:34.207 --> 01:01:37.003 a couple of years of our lives doing this stuff. 1169 01:01:37.141 --> 01:01:39.868 And then we said, okay, we're not gonna stop there. 1170 01:01:40.006 --> 01:01:41.974 We're gonna keep going. 1171 01:02:04.479 --> 01:02:06.032 - In your life, do you wanna be one cover 1172 01:02:06.170 --> 01:02:07.516 on Hit Parade Magazine, 1173 01:02:07.654 --> 01:02:11.382 or would you like to get the Nobel Peace Prize? 1174 01:02:11.520 --> 01:02:12.867 - What was his answer? 1175 01:02:13.005 --> 01:02:14.385 - The Nobel peace prize. 1176 01:02:14.523 --> 01:02:17.388 - So, I mean, the fact is that the news about Harry Chapin 1177 01:02:17.526 --> 01:02:18.942 right now is there's no news. 1178 01:02:19.080 --> 01:02:20.115 I've been doing this for nine years, 1179 01:02:20.253 --> 01:02:21.392 half my concerts are benefits. 1180 01:02:21.530 --> 01:02:23.187 I'm mostly socially and politically involved 1181 01:02:23.325 --> 01:02:25.845 performing in America, I'm going to continue be. 1182 01:02:25.983 --> 01:02:26.950 I'm not gonna get bullied. 1183 01:02:27.088 --> 01:02:28.986 - Ken Kragen had tried to manage Harry. 1184 01:02:29.124 --> 01:02:31.023 He was just, he was the manager of Harry, 1185 01:02:31.161 --> 01:02:32.024 if you could manage him. 1186 01:02:32.162 --> 01:02:33.680 - One of my problems with Harry, 1187 01:02:33.819 --> 01:02:36.131 trying to get Harry to focus on his own career. 1188 01:02:36.269 --> 01:02:38.409 Harry would go do the barbecue in your backyard 1189 01:02:38.547 --> 01:02:40.929 and raise a thousand dollars for some charity. 1190 01:02:41.067 --> 01:02:44.381 Kenny Rogers was very interested in those issues 1191 01:02:44.519 --> 01:02:45.762 and that kind of thing. 1192 01:02:45.900 --> 01:02:47.108 But he would go out 1193 01:02:47.246 --> 01:02:49.317 and raise a hundred thousand dollars in a show. 1194 01:02:49.455 --> 01:02:51.975 - He may have been the single most unselfish person 1195 01:02:52.113 --> 01:02:53.390 I've ever met in my life. 1196 01:02:53.528 --> 01:02:56.876 When he was really involved in this hunger project, 1197 01:02:57.014 --> 01:03:00.328 he would do 150 shows a year for hunger. 1198 01:03:01.225 --> 01:03:03.883 And he would donate, he would make three or $4,000 a night 1199 01:03:04.021 --> 01:03:05.160 and he could donate all this money 1200 01:03:05.298 --> 01:03:07.818 to the hunger projects that he had. 1201 01:03:07.956 --> 01:03:09.751 - What Kenny raised in one show was more 1202 01:03:09.889 --> 01:03:12.789 than what Harry raised in a year shows. 1203 01:03:12.927 --> 01:03:13.859 But he loved it. 1204 01:03:13.997 --> 01:03:16.275 He loved the interaction with the public. 1205 01:03:16.413 --> 01:03:18.277 He loved just talking to them. 1206 01:03:18.415 --> 01:03:20.382 He was such a people person, 1207 01:03:20.520 --> 01:03:24.041 and was making money signing merchandise. 1208 01:03:25.871 --> 01:03:27.734 He felt that was terrific. 1209 01:03:30.910 --> 01:03:32.394 - I'll be out in the lobby, but I forgot to mention that, 1210 01:03:32.532 --> 01:03:35.190 signing anything you want me to sign. 1211 01:03:35.328 --> 01:03:38.400 - He would come to the Huntington Arts Festival, 1212 01:03:38.538 --> 01:03:41.403 which was in back of the YMCA. 1213 01:03:41.541 --> 01:03:43.198 He was there to attract people, 1214 01:03:43.336 --> 01:03:46.408 but he get there and take tickets, he'd collect money. 1215 01:03:46.546 --> 01:03:48.963 He'd be all around the place. 1216 01:03:49.101 --> 01:03:51.034 He'd be singing to people individually, 1217 01:03:51.172 --> 01:03:52.345 he'd be performing. 1218 01:03:52.483 --> 01:03:56.108 - I got up this morning at 5:00 in Hampton Beach, 1219 01:03:56.246 --> 01:04:00.146 New Hampshire to get a limousine driven 1220 01:04:00.284 --> 01:04:03.460 by a rather interesting old gentlemen down to Logan airport 1221 01:04:03.598 --> 01:04:05.289 in Boston and flew down here. 1222 01:04:05.427 --> 01:04:07.188 And I'm impressed, everybody's here ready to go. 1223 01:04:07.326 --> 01:04:10.156 I'm just barely ready myself. 1224 01:04:10.294 --> 01:04:14.333 - What happened is that this frenetic energy 1225 01:04:14.471 --> 01:04:19.510 started to take the focus off of kind of concrete planning 1226 01:04:19.925 --> 01:04:24.343 and maintenance of, I know that's a word 1227 01:04:24.481 --> 01:04:27.760 maintenance, but of the career, 1228 01:04:27.898 --> 01:04:29.313 which is what leverages it all. 1229 01:04:29.451 --> 01:04:32.213 - Every time he was asked to help people, he did it. 1230 01:04:32.351 --> 01:04:36.148 - So cooperative and willing to do anything 1231 01:04:36.286 --> 01:04:38.081 and everything that we ask of him, 1232 01:04:38.219 --> 01:04:40.842 to the point of the guitar and the pencil out of the cable 1233 01:04:40.980 --> 01:04:42.154 and the whole thing. 1234 01:04:42.292 --> 01:04:43.810 - And he said one thing that I always remembered, 1235 01:04:43.949 --> 01:04:46.020 he said, gee, you know, I play one night for me 1236 01:04:46.158 --> 01:04:48.539 and one night for the other guy. 1237 01:04:48.677 --> 01:04:51.128 And later on when I was trying to put my music 1238 01:04:51.266 --> 01:04:55.201 to some pragmatic piece, I remember what he said. 1239 01:04:55.339 --> 01:04:57.859 Not being bent to extremism, 1240 01:04:57.997 --> 01:05:01.104 I wasn't as generous as he was, but. 1241 01:05:01.242 --> 01:05:03.969 - It was a bone of contention, you know, 1242 01:05:04.107 --> 01:05:06.178 I mean, with various people. 1243 01:05:06.316 --> 01:05:09.353 The band didn't think he should be doing that many shows. 1244 01:05:09.491 --> 01:05:13.047 I mean, sometimes he would do a show, you know, 1245 01:05:13.185 --> 01:05:16.429 50 miles from Columbus, Ohio a month before we 1246 01:05:16.567 --> 01:05:19.570 were actually doing municipal arena. 1247 01:05:20.571 --> 01:05:22.332 - I do about 200 concerts a year, 1248 01:05:22.470 --> 01:05:23.436 about 100 which are benefits. 1249 01:05:23.574 --> 01:05:24.955 Mostly with the group, 1250 01:05:25.093 --> 01:05:26.405 but tonight it's gonna be a little bit different. 1251 01:05:26.543 --> 01:05:27.889 - Really wanted to make people happy. 1252 01:05:28.027 --> 01:05:30.202 So he didn't want to go around pissing people off 1253 01:05:30.340 --> 01:05:31.824 or frustrating them. 1254 01:05:31.962 --> 01:05:33.515 It's just tough to stop the train, you know? 1255 01:05:33.653 --> 01:05:36.518 And he certainly couldn't get off. 1256 01:05:36.656 --> 01:05:37.934 - I wrote this song 1257 01:05:38.072 --> 01:05:40.074 about the same time I wrote "Cat's in the Cradle." 1258 01:05:40.212 --> 01:05:41.868 - Well, he wasn't going to be talked out of it. 1259 01:05:42.007 --> 01:05:43.077 - He could drive you crazy, 1260 01:05:43.215 --> 01:05:45.527 and he was completely unscrupulous about 1261 01:05:45.665 --> 01:05:47.598 It was always for the greater good, 1262 01:05:47.736 --> 01:05:49.600 and often it actually was. 1263 01:05:55.158 --> 01:05:58.264 - It was inspiring, how motivated he was 1264 01:05:58.402 --> 01:05:59.541 to try to help others. 1265 01:05:59.679 --> 01:06:01.474 You couldn't help but see that. 1266 01:06:01.612 --> 01:06:03.200 He was like a saint. 1267 01:06:03.338 --> 01:06:06.307 And to the point of being a martyr. 1268 01:06:08.481 --> 01:06:12.347 - This is as far back as September 16th, 1976. 1269 01:06:13.314 --> 01:06:16.351 And he's making promises of how his life 1270 01:06:16.489 --> 01:06:19.113 is gonna look in November, 1976. 1271 01:06:19.251 --> 01:06:21.218 This one didn't take or really, 1272 01:06:21.356 --> 01:06:24.773 you can see how difficult it was gonna be 1273 01:06:26.189 --> 01:06:28.915 for him to adhere to this over a long period of time, 1274 01:06:29.054 --> 01:06:30.331 because there was just too much to do. 1275 01:06:30.469 --> 01:06:32.919 At this time you got two really powerful people. 1276 01:06:33.058 --> 01:06:35.336 Sandy is a powerful person. 1277 01:06:37.062 --> 01:06:38.960 Harry's an incredibly powerful person. 1278 01:06:39.098 --> 01:06:43.723 And Harry is racing toward whatever destiny he envisioned 1279 01:06:45.001 --> 01:06:47.348 and worrying, getting it done. 1280 01:06:47.486 --> 01:06:50.144 And Sandy had been through all this stuff. 1281 01:06:50.282 --> 01:06:53.216 The marriage was really rocky right then. 1282 01:06:53.354 --> 01:06:54.907 - As you go through your life, you get a little older, 1283 01:06:55.045 --> 01:06:56.115 you run a couple of years under your belt. 1284 01:06:56.253 --> 01:06:58.428 You start realizing that the story of your life 1285 01:06:58.566 --> 01:07:01.534 is not always those golden dreams you're chasing, 1286 01:07:01.672 --> 01:07:04.434 but the people that you end up spending your time with. 1287 01:07:04.572 --> 01:07:07.713 And usually, hopefully, it's a spouse. 1288 01:07:08.610 --> 01:07:11.337 And so this is a song of a guy whose spent some time 1289 01:07:11.475 --> 01:07:14.927 and suddenly is seeing his life flashed back in front of him 1290 01:07:15.065 --> 01:07:16.687 and reassessing everything. 1291 01:07:16.825 --> 01:07:20.519 - Okay, Mr. Harry Chapin, "Story of a Life." 1292 01:08:04.632 --> 01:08:05.529 - I have an agenda, I'm not-- 1293 01:08:05.667 --> 01:08:07.117 - What is your agenda? 1294 01:08:07.255 --> 01:08:09.119 - Well, I want to matter. 1295 01:08:09.257 --> 01:08:10.500 Every human being wants to matter. 1296 01:08:10.638 --> 01:08:12.536 Gene McCarthy said it brilliantly about football. 1297 01:08:12.674 --> 01:08:14.987 He said, you gotta be smart enough to play the game 1298 01:08:15.125 --> 01:08:16.161 and dumb enough to think it matters. 1299 01:08:16.299 --> 01:08:18.232 Well in terms of pop music, 1300 01:08:18.370 --> 01:08:20.475 I'm not quite dumb enough to think it matters. 1301 01:08:20.613 --> 01:08:22.477 I'm just smart enough to play the game. 1302 01:08:22.615 --> 01:08:24.134 So I put it in the context. 1303 01:08:24.272 --> 01:08:26.309 I'm a man who generates about two and a half million dollars 1304 01:08:26.447 --> 01:08:27.482 every year, and I'm broke. 1305 01:08:27.620 --> 01:08:29.001 I mean my net worth right now, 1306 01:08:29.139 --> 01:08:30.382 my accountant told me it's zero. 1307 01:08:30.520 --> 01:08:33.592 It goes through me and I feel that that's my security. 1308 01:08:33.730 --> 01:08:35.456 My security is to be on the edge. 1309 01:08:35.594 --> 01:08:36.388 - What are you gonna do? 1310 01:08:36.526 --> 01:08:37.630 And what are you not gonna do? 1311 01:08:37.768 --> 01:08:39.563 And he had no idea. 1312 01:08:39.701 --> 01:08:42.048 You're traveling on the edge. 1313 01:08:42.187 --> 01:08:43.533 You know, you're always racing. 1314 01:08:43.671 --> 01:08:44.913 You're late. 1315 01:08:45.051 --> 01:08:47.295 You're traveling five times as much as anybody else. 1316 01:08:47.433 --> 01:08:49.746 You're just upping the odds. 1317 01:09:05.210 --> 01:09:07.039 - I would hate to be 75 years old, 1318 01:09:07.177 --> 01:09:09.628 it's one of the things that arms me, 1319 01:09:09.766 --> 01:09:11.802 and say, if only I had, I wish I had, 1320 01:09:11.940 --> 01:09:14.219 I wonder what my life meant. 1321 01:09:14.357 --> 01:09:17.222 My credo, which might be interesting for 1322 01:09:17.360 --> 01:09:20.190 is when in doubt, do something. 1323 01:09:20.328 --> 01:09:22.606 Because in the long run, we're not sure about a prior life 1324 01:09:22.744 --> 01:09:23.711 or an afterlife. 1325 01:09:23.849 --> 01:09:24.988 We're all hoping for that. 1326 01:09:25.126 --> 01:09:27.266 But what we can do is maximize what we have 1327 01:09:27.404 --> 01:09:30.304 in his brief flicker of time, in the infinity, 1328 01:09:30.442 --> 01:09:32.651 and try to milk that. 1329 01:09:32.789 --> 01:09:35.481 Let's say there was an imaginary automobile company 1330 01:09:35.619 --> 01:09:37.242 that built automobiles, 1331 01:09:37.380 --> 01:09:41.315 that when hit from behind burst into flame. 1332 01:09:41.453 --> 01:09:43.109 Now nothing like that would ever happened in the real world, 1333 01:09:43.248 --> 01:09:44.490 you know that. 1334 01:09:44.628 --> 01:09:46.768 - Ballad writer and singer Harry Chapin died today 1335 01:09:46.906 --> 01:09:48.598 in a car crash in Long Island. 1336 01:09:48.736 --> 01:09:50.634 - His death came suddenly in a fiery collision 1337 01:09:50.772 --> 01:09:53.258 with a tractor trailer truck on a Long Island highway. 1338 01:09:53.396 --> 01:09:55.156 - Harry was to have given a concert last night 1339 01:09:55.294 --> 01:09:58.366 on Long Island, as usual, it would have been free. 1340 01:10:08.445 --> 01:10:10.758 - In the insecurity that we have about a prior life 1341 01:10:10.896 --> 01:10:12.863 or an afterlife with God, I hope there is a God. 1342 01:10:13.001 --> 01:10:14.831 If he does exist, he's got a rather weird 1343 01:10:14.969 --> 01:10:17.005 sense of humor, however. 1344 01:10:18.352 --> 01:10:20.285 But if there's a process that will allow us 1345 01:10:20.423 --> 01:10:23.115 to live our days, that will allow us that degree 1346 01:10:23.253 --> 01:10:25.393 of equanimity towards the end, 1347 01:10:25.531 --> 01:10:28.431 looking at that black implacable wall of death, 1348 01:10:28.569 --> 01:10:30.364 to allow us that degree of peace, 1349 01:10:30.502 --> 01:10:33.401 that degree of non-fear, I want in. 1350 01:10:52.489 --> 01:10:53.697 - I lived in a loft right below 1351 01:10:53.835 --> 01:10:56.597 with management loft was Jeb and Bob Hinkle. 1352 01:10:56.735 --> 01:10:58.184 And there was a new secretary and she comes down 1353 01:10:58.323 --> 01:10:59.324 and knocks on the door. 1354 01:10:59.462 --> 01:11:00.601 And Jeb and Bob are waiting for Harry 1355 01:11:00.739 --> 01:11:03.466 in the city here to talk about booking 1356 01:11:03.604 --> 01:11:06.192 and try to convince him not to do so many benefits. 1357 01:11:06.331 --> 01:11:10.266 - On July 15th, the day before Harry was killed, 1358 01:11:10.404 --> 01:11:14.270 there was a meeting scheduled at ICM with the great agent, 1359 01:11:14.408 --> 01:11:18.515 Shelley Schultz, who ran the department for ICM. 1360 01:11:18.653 --> 01:11:22.933 And this was a meeting to really go over some specifics 1361 01:11:23.071 --> 01:11:26.178 about how we have to, it's like a come to Jesus. 1362 01:11:26.316 --> 01:11:28.422 We've really got to focus on the career. 1363 01:11:28.560 --> 01:11:30.596 What we're doing here is diminishing returns. 1364 01:11:30.734 --> 01:11:31.839 You're hurting yourself. 1365 01:11:31.977 --> 01:11:34.290 And it was to try to come up with an agreement 1366 01:11:34.428 --> 01:11:37.293 that would help Harry, A, help his career, 1367 01:11:37.431 --> 01:11:41.538 and help him make more money for the charities. 1368 01:11:45.542 --> 01:11:47.889 And on July 15th, Harry didn't show for that meeting. 1369 01:11:48.027 --> 01:11:49.235 I was really pissed. 1370 01:11:49.374 --> 01:11:51.962 I think I even called my mother. 1371 01:11:55.069 --> 01:11:57.554 So the next day it was rescheduled. 1372 01:11:57.692 --> 01:11:58.900 So he said, I'll come tomorrow, 1373 01:11:59.038 --> 01:12:00.212 I'm sorry, I'll just do it tomorrow. 1374 01:12:00.350 --> 01:12:02.248 So we scheduled it for the next day. 1375 01:12:02.387 --> 01:12:03.629 When we were at the meeting the next day, 1376 01:12:03.767 --> 01:12:07.357 and the time started to pass and Harry wasn't there, 1377 01:12:07.495 --> 01:12:10.602 I did kind of have a little bad feeling 1378 01:12:10.740 --> 01:12:12.535 because I had made such a big stink, 1379 01:12:12.673 --> 01:12:14.640 Harry had been so sheepish about it, 1380 01:12:14.778 --> 01:12:15.952 and we had set it up. 1381 01:12:16.090 --> 01:12:18.748 I just couldn't imagine him not showing for that. 1382 01:12:18.886 --> 01:12:20.577 - I got on the phone and it was a cop. 1383 01:12:20.715 --> 01:12:25.651 And he says, what relation are you to the deceased? 1384 01:12:25.789 --> 01:12:27.515 And I go, what? 1385 01:12:27.653 --> 01:12:31.726 He says, and turns out someone had died on the expressway. 1386 01:12:31.864 --> 01:12:34.557 And they didn't know who it was, 1387 01:12:35.661 --> 01:12:37.422 because his wallet had burned up. 1388 01:12:37.560 --> 01:12:40.356 He was rear ended on the expressway 1389 01:12:40.494 --> 01:12:43.980 and died principally because that the seatbelt 1390 01:12:44.118 --> 01:12:45.637 that was in the Volkswagen Rabbit 1391 01:12:45.775 --> 01:12:47.708 was really a one-point seatbelt, 1392 01:12:47.846 --> 01:12:50.400 over the top of the shoulder. 1393 01:12:50.538 --> 01:12:52.747 It wasn't across his waist. 1394 01:12:52.885 --> 01:12:55.543 The driver got, busted the window, cut his thing, 1395 01:12:55.681 --> 01:12:56.544 pulled him out. 1396 01:12:56.682 --> 01:12:58.339 So he was partly burned his hands. 1397 01:12:58.477 --> 01:13:00.962 The way I recognized him was that he had a watch, 1398 01:13:01.100 --> 01:13:02.481 a pocket watch on him. 1399 01:13:02.619 --> 01:13:04.794 It said from Michael Moore. 1400 01:13:05.795 --> 01:13:07.452 Harry had done benefits. 1401 01:13:07.590 --> 01:13:11.421 I told Michael Moore this recently, he went, oh my gosh. 1402 01:13:11.559 --> 01:13:13.492 Harry had done three or four benefits for Michael Moore 1403 01:13:13.630 --> 01:13:15.287 to start the Flint Voice 1404 01:13:15.425 --> 01:13:17.047 and then the Michigan Voice early on. 1405 01:13:17.185 --> 01:13:19.533 As Michael Moore says, no Harry, no Michael Moore. 1406 01:13:19.671 --> 01:13:22.570 - He was such a generous individual, giving. 1407 01:13:22.708 --> 01:13:26.954 He didn't know me from Adam, and he said, sure, 1408 01:13:27.092 --> 01:13:28.818 I'll come to Flint and help you out. 1409 01:13:28.956 --> 01:13:31.337 And they gave him a watch that said, from the Flint Voice 1410 01:13:31.476 --> 01:13:34.824 to a great American, or something, Harry Chapin 1411 01:13:34.962 --> 01:13:36.377 from Michael Moore. 1412 01:13:36.515 --> 01:13:37.827 And I said, dad, that's Harry. 1413 01:13:37.965 --> 01:13:39.553 That's the Michael Moore watch. 1414 01:13:39.691 --> 01:13:41.417 - I was in a meeting with the city at the time. 1415 01:13:41.555 --> 01:13:43.315 And I got a call from Tom. 1416 01:13:43.453 --> 01:13:45.351 The fact he's getting through means it's bad. 1417 01:13:45.490 --> 01:13:46.836 Because it was a big, big deal meeting, 1418 01:13:46.974 --> 01:13:48.665 had like, top guys from the city. 1419 01:13:48.803 --> 01:13:52.289 I said, Tom, it's Harry I says, is it bad? 1420 01:13:52.428 --> 01:13:53.014 He says yes, it's real bad. 1421 01:13:53.152 --> 01:13:53.981 I said, is he dead? 1422 01:13:54.119 --> 01:13:55.431 He says, Yeah, he's dead. 1423 01:14:09.617 --> 01:14:11.308 - I could have been in that car. 1424 01:14:11.447 --> 01:14:14.070 I've thought about this many times. 1425 01:14:14.208 --> 01:14:16.866 And in a way my wife saved my life 1426 01:14:17.004 --> 01:14:18.695 because she asked me to go up to Massachusetts 1427 01:14:18.833 --> 01:14:21.111 to visit her cousin. 1428 01:14:21.249 --> 01:14:22.941 So I said to Harry, I can't make this. 1429 01:14:23.079 --> 01:14:25.875 - We had been in Hawaii for one of our family vacations 1430 01:14:26.013 --> 01:14:26.979 for two weeks. 1431 01:14:27.117 --> 01:14:28.602 And the rest of the family flew back. 1432 01:14:28.740 --> 01:14:30.638 I stayed because I had friends in Hawaii 1433 01:14:30.776 --> 01:14:34.435 and I was expected to come back, I don't know, 1434 01:14:34.573 --> 01:14:35.954 about a week later or something. 1435 01:14:36.092 --> 01:14:39.371 And I had called the house and no one wanted to talk to me. 1436 01:14:39.509 --> 01:14:41.787 They said they would call me back, which I thought was odd. 1437 01:14:41.925 --> 01:14:43.824 - I remember a conversation between him 1438 01:14:43.962 --> 01:14:46.033 and my mom when he was leaving that morning. 1439 01:14:46.171 --> 01:14:47.966 And there was a question 1440 01:14:48.104 --> 01:14:49.243 as to whether I was gonna go with him. 1441 01:14:49.381 --> 01:14:51.452 Which is one of those crazy sorta, you know, 1442 01:14:51.590 --> 01:14:53.558 I missed the plane that crashed or whatever. 1443 01:14:53.696 --> 01:14:57.078 But so I feel like that's part of my memory 1444 01:14:57.216 --> 01:15:00.012 is that I was sort of kind of excited 1445 01:15:00.150 --> 01:15:02.463 and like, Oh, I'm gonna have to spend the day with my dad. 1446 01:15:02.601 --> 01:15:04.603 And it was just sorta like, no, it doesn't make sense, 1447 01:15:04.741 --> 01:15:06.571 you'll see him later. 1448 01:15:14.924 --> 01:15:16.960 - I was on the beach, so I had no idea. 1449 01:15:17.098 --> 01:15:20.826 I remember it was dark by the time we got back. 1450 01:15:20.964 --> 01:15:24.002 Our friend came out to the car and she said, 1451 01:15:24.140 --> 01:15:26.004 did you hear what happened? 1452 01:15:26.142 --> 01:15:30.180 It's a horrible thing, Harry Chapin died on the expressway. 1453 01:15:30.318 --> 01:15:32.113 And she didn't know I was in the car. 1454 01:15:32.251 --> 01:15:34.288 So that's how I heard it. 1455 01:15:54.135 --> 01:15:55.999 - I was home on long Island 1456 01:15:56.137 --> 01:15:57.898 and there were all these different stories. 1457 01:15:58.036 --> 01:15:59.969 Oh, this happened, or it was a crash 1458 01:16:00.107 --> 01:16:01.177 or it was a this or it was that. 1459 01:16:01.315 --> 01:16:03.524 It was just totally unexpected. 1460 01:16:03.662 --> 01:16:07.459 Because he was, he was such a vital guy. 1461 01:16:07.597 --> 01:16:09.565 He was so alive, Harry. 1462 01:16:09.703 --> 01:16:12.464 You just can't imagine him the sick 1463 01:16:12.602 --> 01:16:14.466 or something like that happening to him. 1464 01:16:14.604 --> 01:16:16.019 It's just, no, that wouldn't happen to Harry. 1465 01:16:16.157 --> 01:16:17.089 It wouldn't happen to him. 1466 01:16:17.227 --> 01:16:18.643 And it did. 1467 01:16:18.781 --> 01:16:21.577 - We were in New York, Spyder and I, and in my apartment. 1468 01:16:21.715 --> 01:16:23.130 And I had WNEW on. 1469 01:16:26.651 --> 01:16:30.068 And I don't even know what was playing before or whatever, 1470 01:16:30.206 --> 01:16:32.726 but it was like a news flash. 1471 01:16:33.727 --> 01:16:34.900 We were in shock. 1472 01:16:35.038 --> 01:16:36.626 I mean, there was no other thing to say. 1473 01:16:36.764 --> 01:16:40.009 And then just the supreme sadness of it. 1474 01:16:41.217 --> 01:16:45.324 Of knowing that that light had gone out, you know, 1475 01:16:46.325 --> 01:16:48.742 just, it was hurtful. 1476 01:16:48.880 --> 01:16:49.570 - I remember crying. 1477 01:16:49.708 --> 01:16:51.710 I cried a lot, you know. 1478 01:16:55.024 --> 01:16:57.164 And my first instinct is what my first instinct 1479 01:16:57.302 --> 01:17:01.237 has been before that and since then, it's not fair. 1480 01:17:01.375 --> 01:17:04.205 This is the last guy you'd expect to die young. 1481 01:17:04.343 --> 01:17:06.380 Absolutely the last guy. 1482 01:17:08.796 --> 01:17:13.042 - I maybe wondered whether there was a God up there. 1483 01:17:14.043 --> 01:17:15.251 - When Harry died, I considered 1484 01:17:15.389 --> 01:17:16.839 it the biggest loss of my life. 1485 01:17:16.977 --> 01:17:19.151 - And the universe cracked. 1486 01:17:55.153 --> 01:17:57.776 - My name is Bill Ayers, and if I can hold myself together 1487 01:17:57.914 --> 01:17:59.916 for the next couple hours here, 1488 01:18:00.054 --> 01:18:02.263 I'm supposed to lead us through this memorial service 1489 01:18:02.401 --> 01:18:04.749 for our friend and brother Harry Chapin. 1490 01:18:04.887 --> 01:18:07.096 - I'll never see, never think of Harry 1491 01:18:07.234 --> 01:18:09.892 without big grin on his face in a hurry, 1492 01:18:10.030 --> 01:18:13.309 arriving just in time to go on stage 1493 01:18:13.447 --> 01:18:16.312 and dashing off right afterwards because he had 1494 01:18:16.450 --> 01:18:18.038 to be somewhere else an hour later. 1495 01:18:41.855 --> 01:18:45.341 - Now Harry's wonderful, and very loving wife, Sandy, 1496 01:18:45.479 --> 01:18:47.343 came up with the idea 1497 01:18:48.275 --> 01:18:49.966 of a Presidential Commission, World Hunger. 1498 01:18:50.104 --> 01:18:52.141 She gave the formidable task to Harry. 1499 01:18:52.279 --> 01:18:53.798 I could have told her it was impossible 1500 01:18:53.936 --> 01:18:57.767 if she'd ever asked me, but Sandy knew better. 1501 01:18:59.148 --> 01:19:01.598 And all of us in Washington told Harry that the President's 1502 01:19:01.737 --> 01:19:02.910 opposed to any more commissions. 1503 01:19:03.048 --> 01:19:04.291 It'd be impossible. 1504 01:19:04.429 --> 01:19:05.982 There were logistical, there were partisan reasons. 1505 01:19:06.120 --> 01:19:08.019 There were all these reasons why it couldn't be done. 1506 01:19:08.157 --> 01:19:10.331 Harry said, that's nice, and now here's how we're going 1507 01:19:10.469 --> 01:19:12.333 to go about doing it. 1508 01:19:27.521 --> 01:19:29.765 - I think we're also both believers in the udge factor, 1509 01:19:29.903 --> 01:19:32.802 which is the combination of all those little things 1510 01:19:32.940 --> 01:19:34.079 that people do in many different areas 1511 01:19:34.217 --> 01:19:36.081 that end up by making a great big udge 1512 01:19:36.219 --> 01:19:38.359 that tends to move things. 1513 01:19:42.467 --> 01:19:45.953 - Door is open, we're ushered in to see the precedent. 1514 01:19:46.091 --> 01:19:50.337 Even at that meeting, even after Harry beat him down 1515 01:19:51.407 --> 01:19:53.961 and President Carter agreed to go along 1516 01:19:54.099 --> 01:19:57.793 with the World Hunger Commission, Harry wouldn't stop. 1517 01:19:57.931 --> 01:19:59.449 He continued to hammer into the president 1518 01:19:59.587 --> 01:20:01.935 the reasons why we had to have this. 1519 01:20:02.073 --> 01:20:05.076 The president sat there, he said, tried to say, you know, 1520 01:20:05.214 --> 01:20:07.906 I've agreed with you, I've agreed with you. 1521 01:20:08.044 --> 01:20:09.114 He did agree. 1522 01:20:11.220 --> 01:20:13.360 Harry wasn't gonna let him off that easy. 1523 01:20:13.498 --> 01:20:15.880 Not just by agreeing. 1524 01:20:16.018 --> 01:20:21.023 He wanted not only to agree, he wanted him to be committed, 1525 01:20:21.402 --> 01:20:23.922 wanted to be committed. 1526 01:20:24.060 --> 01:20:27.374 Now that's the difference between Harry Chapin 1527 01:20:27.512 --> 01:20:32.379 and those who simply give lip service to our cause. 1528 01:20:45.150 --> 01:20:46.876 - Tom, I think, once said that being brother to Harry 1529 01:20:47.014 --> 01:20:48.913 was like being brother to a steam engine. 1530 01:20:49.051 --> 01:20:50.224 And there's some truth to that, I mean, that's what he was. 1531 01:20:50.362 --> 01:20:52.502 He was a source of energy, you know, in a world, 1532 01:20:52.640 --> 01:20:54.815 unfortunately, that's all too short of energy. 1533 01:21:00.994 --> 01:21:04.342 - And this is a song from his last album, 1534 01:21:05.239 --> 01:21:09.381 which I thought was one of the best he ever wrote. 1535 01:21:39.032 --> 01:21:44.071 what we dreamed of for 1536 01:21:57.291 --> 01:22:00.916 - Harry had a good insight about how people 1537 01:22:01.054 --> 01:22:05.472 should be treated, that everybody deserves compassion. 1538 01:22:08.130 --> 01:22:11.098 - Harry really didn't care about doing any of these things 1539 01:22:11.236 --> 01:22:12.617 to get to heaven. 1540 01:22:12.755 --> 01:22:15.551 He always figured, that would sort of take care of itself. 1541 01:22:15.689 --> 01:22:19.175 He was doing things because of this life. 1542 01:22:30.704 --> 01:22:33.120 - I had dreams about Harry. 1543 01:22:45.512 --> 01:22:47.169 - Well, all of us have had dreams about Harry, 1544 01:22:47.307 --> 01:22:48.377 I think that close to him. 1545 01:22:48.515 --> 01:22:49.999 This is one I had. 1546 01:22:50.137 --> 01:22:53.002 So I call this the very best place to be. 1547 01:22:53.140 --> 01:22:57.248 In my dreams, I saw him, alive and well once more. 1548 01:22:59.422 --> 01:23:02.632 He was ready to greet me on a far distant shore. 1549 01:23:02.770 --> 01:23:04.496 His smile lit up like the morning sun 1550 01:23:04.634 --> 01:23:06.982 and I could feel my spirit soar. 1551 01:23:07.120 --> 01:23:08.914 And he said, welcome my brother 1552 01:23:09.053 --> 01:23:12.194 to the treasures we have in store. 1553 01:23:26.242 --> 01:23:29.452 - I really got involved in the issues of hunger 1554 01:23:29.590 --> 01:23:31.592 and homelessness due to Harry. 1555 01:23:37.702 --> 01:23:42.672 Literally felt, physically felt Harry Chapin crawl inside me 1556 01:23:43.846 --> 01:23:45.675 and I felt he was orchestrating everything. 1557 01:23:57.584 --> 01:23:59.379 Harry was truly the inspiration 1558 01:23:59.517 --> 01:24:01.933 for all the good works I did since his death. 1559 01:24:02.071 --> 01:24:04.384 Things like we are the world and the song, 1560 01:24:04.522 --> 01:24:07.525 and which is still going strong to this day. 1561 01:24:07.663 --> 01:24:10.148 And hand across America, five and a half million people 1562 01:24:10.286 --> 01:24:14.118 holding hands in one continuous line from New York to LA 1563 01:24:14.256 --> 01:24:16.396 all for the purpose of raising awareness 1564 01:24:16.534 --> 01:24:19.502 about hunger and homelessness in America. 1565 01:24:19.640 --> 01:24:22.402 Inspired greatly by Harry Chapin and his beliefs. 1566 01:24:22.540 --> 01:24:25.474 - Harry Chapin died five years ago. 1567 01:24:27.303 --> 01:24:30.513 It was a cruel death and a great loss. 1568 01:24:30.651 --> 01:24:35.622 But he'd thrown a pebble into a pond and I saw the ripples. 1569 01:24:38.280 --> 01:24:42.422 Reached Geldoff, reached me, reached Willie Nelson, 1570 01:24:43.526 --> 01:24:46.219 reached millions of people around the world. 1571 01:24:46.357 --> 01:24:48.669 When Harry Belafonte called me, 1572 01:24:48.807 --> 01:24:52.397 I was exactly in the frame of mind to build a lobby further 1573 01:24:52.535 --> 01:24:54.399 for USA for Africa. 1574 01:24:54.537 --> 01:24:58.576 Once we have those two, we could extend this idea 1575 01:24:59.715 --> 01:25:01.889 to the planet, so Live Aid. 1576 01:25:04.892 --> 01:25:07.309 - Guys like Harry was very inspirational 1577 01:25:07.447 --> 01:25:10.657 to what the whole purpose of hip hop was for. 1578 01:25:10.795 --> 01:25:14.730 To get off your butt and do something about the conditions. 1579 01:25:14.868 --> 01:25:19.010 - Welcome in, welcome in to the lost and forsaken. 1580 01:25:19.148 --> 01:25:23.670 This is a better place to be, the very best place to be. 1581 01:25:34.888 --> 01:25:38.995 - An incredibly generous older brother, you know. 1582 01:25:39.134 --> 01:25:40.549 He was, as he was as a man. 1583 01:25:40.687 --> 01:25:43.448 So you got me emotional now. 1584 01:25:43.586 --> 01:25:46.727 - He really wanted to change the world, and he did. 1585 01:25:46.865 --> 01:25:48.522 - Harry Chapman was posthumously 1586 01:25:48.660 --> 01:25:51.629 given the highest civilian honor the United States 1587 01:25:51.767 --> 01:25:55.805 can bestow, the special Congressional Gold Medal 1588 01:25:55.943 --> 01:25:58.670 was awarded a Harry for his devotion to the issue 1589 01:25:58.808 --> 01:26:01.501 of hunger around the world. 1590 01:26:01.639 --> 01:26:06.471 This medal has been given by Congress to only 114 citizens 1591 01:26:06.609 --> 01:26:10.095 in the more than 200 years since the country was founded. 1592 01:26:10.234 --> 01:26:13.823 Only four other songwriters have received the medal. 1593 01:26:13.961 --> 01:26:18.276 George and Ira Gershwin, George M. Cohan, and Irving Berlin. 1594 01:26:18.414 --> 01:26:21.417 Other recipients include George Washington, 1595 01:26:21.555 --> 01:26:26.181 Robert F. Kennedy, Thomas Edison, and now Harry Chapin. 1596 01:26:38.434 --> 01:26:42.162 - Oh if a man tried to take his time on earth 1597 01:26:42.300 --> 01:26:45.372 and prove before he died, what one man's life 1598 01:26:45.510 --> 01:26:50.308 could be worth, I wonder what would happen to this world? 1599 01:26:53.000 --> 01:26:55.865 - COVID-19 is brought out the best in people. 1600 01:26:56.003 --> 01:26:58.213 We can't forget that 40 years ago, 1601 01:26:58.351 --> 01:27:00.215 there was one person and one person only 1602 01:27:00.353 --> 01:27:03.252 who spoke about the issue of food insecurity 1603 01:27:03.390 --> 01:27:04.598 and hunger in this country. 1604 01:27:09.707 --> 01:27:14.125 And if Harry were alive today, what would he be doing? 1605 01:27:14.263 --> 01:27:16.679 He would be doing exactly what he did 40 years ago, 1606 01:27:16.817 --> 01:27:19.855 and that's speaking out and creating a response. 1607 01:27:19.993 --> 01:27:21.857 He saw hunger as a shame of America, 1608 01:27:21.995 --> 01:27:23.617 and he did something about it 1609 01:27:23.755 --> 01:27:27.172 by establishing Long Island Cares and Why Hunger. 1610 01:27:27.311 --> 01:27:28.691 How grateful should we be as a nation 1611 01:27:28.829 --> 01:27:30.590 that's 40 years after he's gone, 1612 01:27:30.728 --> 01:27:34.732 this man's legacy continues stronger than ever? 1613 01:27:39.323 --> 01:27:42.222 - We certainly have helped millions of people, 1614 01:27:42.360 --> 01:27:44.845 hundreds of thousands of kids in the summer, 1615 01:27:44.983 --> 01:27:46.537 every year annually. 1616 01:27:46.675 --> 01:27:50.403 We help hundreds of thousands of callers 1617 01:27:50.541 --> 01:27:52.405 that reach out to our hotline. 1618 01:27:52.543 --> 01:27:54.372 And through our direct partnerships 1619 01:27:54.510 --> 01:27:58.618 with grassroots organizations who are feeding people, 1620 01:27:58.756 --> 01:28:02.449 serving food, we have been able to build their capacity 1621 01:28:02.587 --> 01:28:04.831 to serve millions of people. 1622 01:28:19.811 --> 01:28:22.400 - We take care of people's fundamental wellbeing. 1623 01:28:22.538 --> 01:28:25.369 We don't ask questions about income. 1624 01:28:25.507 --> 01:28:28.337 We don't ask questions about immigration status. 1625 01:28:28.475 --> 01:28:30.684 We don't ask about people's resources. 1626 01:28:30.822 --> 01:28:34.378 All we know is that people are struggling. 1627 01:28:39.900 --> 01:28:41.212 - Yes, I'm hopeful. 1628 01:28:41.350 --> 01:28:44.526 I'm out there each and every day trying to bring 1629 01:28:44.664 --> 01:28:48.564 to the conversation of why is there hunger and poverty? 1630 01:28:48.702 --> 01:28:51.636 And I think both Bill and Harry would be happy 1631 01:28:51.774 --> 01:28:53.983 to the fact to see that the organization, Why Hunger, 1632 01:28:54.121 --> 01:28:57.987 has not only tackled that question locally, 1633 01:28:58.125 --> 01:29:01.474 but has really tackled that question globally. 1634 01:29:11.069 --> 01:29:15.557 - First, they ignore you, then they laugh at you, 1635 01:29:15.695 --> 01:29:18.560 then they fight you, then you win. 1636 01:29:23.358 --> 01:29:24.393 He few things right. 1637 01:29:24.531 --> 01:29:26.740 - But I think Harry instinctively knew 1638 01:29:26.878 --> 01:29:29.985 that it was gonna take a lot more than just love to survive, 1639 01:29:30.123 --> 01:29:33.506 that it was gonna take a strong sense of purpose, 1640 01:29:33.644 --> 01:29:38.614 a duty, and a good clear eye on the dirty ways of the world. 1641 01:29:42.791 --> 01:29:46.139 And so in keeping his promise to himself, 1642 01:29:47.140 --> 01:29:50.626 he reminds us of our promise to ourselves. 1643 01:29:50.764 --> 01:29:53.664 And then tonight, alongside Harry, 1644 01:29:55.528 --> 01:30:00.015 it's that promise that his spirit would have us remember 1645 01:30:02.431 --> 01:30:04.191 and honor and recommit, 1646 01:30:06.573 --> 01:30:07.850 so do something. 1647 01:30:09.714 --> 01:30:12.476 And may his song be song. 1648 01:30:34.946 --> 01:30:37.293 - Life is not a neat entity. 1649 01:30:37.432 --> 01:30:39.641 It's a Grade C movie. 1650 01:30:39.779 --> 01:30:40.814 It's not a Grade a movie 1651 01:30:40.952 --> 01:30:42.851 where everything neatly fits into place. 1652 01:30:42.989 --> 01:30:44.335 It's sloppy. 1653 01:30:44.473 --> 01:30:47.856 But the final analysis it's terribly, terribly exciting 1654 01:30:47.994 --> 01:30:50.652 and to, in a sense, immerse yourself into it 1655 01:30:50.790 --> 01:30:55.070 and all those complexities rather than hide from it. 1656 01:31:15.918 --> 01:31:17.541 I believe in believers. 1657 01:31:17.679 --> 01:31:20.371 At a time when there's gigantic questions, 1658 01:31:20.509 --> 01:31:21.890 engagement is the answer. 1659 01:31:22.028 --> 01:31:23.685 I love, however, when you find some kind 1660 01:31:23.823 --> 01:31:26.826 of perverse patterns, and that's what circles to me are. 1661 01:31:26.964 --> 01:31:29.104 Hey, Tom Chapin, come on out here 1662 01:31:29.242 --> 01:31:32.452 and help us do something, come on. 1663 01:31:32.590 --> 01:31:35.731 I wrote this thing for you, here we go. 1664 01:31:38.872 --> 01:31:41.944 - Everybody learning and growing and sharing 1665 01:31:42.082 --> 01:31:45.500 and moving, because otherwise it's a dead end. 1666 01:32:32.236 --> 01:32:34.169 - Think you've really made a difference. 1667 01:32:34.307 --> 01:32:36.723 - I don't know, but I've been involved with the good people 1668 01:32:36.861 --> 01:32:40.796 with alive hearts, alive heads, and alive acts. 1669 01:33:02.369 --> 01:33:05.787 - I miss him, and I miss what he missed. 1670 01:33:07.685 --> 01:33:08.893 Here we are talking about him. 1671 01:33:09.031 --> 01:33:11.516 Harry, you're still here, baby. 1672 01:33:11.655 --> 01:33:15.106 - Let's put your hands together and have a great big ending! 1673 01:33:33.918 --> 01:33:36.024 - You guys are outrageous. 1674 01:33:36.162 --> 01:33:39.579 Steve Chapin, Big John Wallace, Howard Fields, 1675 01:33:39.717 --> 01:33:42.858 Doug Walker, Yvonne Cable, Tom Chapin.